Posters please read this-The Associated Press to Set Guidelines for Using Its Article

**Blessedx4** · #1 June 17th, 2008, 01:08 PM

(Note that this is not just blogs but any reposting of news articles, even if you're just passing on a news story to co-workers etc.)

What is Piracy?
http://www.siia.net/piracy/whatis.asp#Internet

The Associated Press to Set Guidelines for Using Its Articles in Blogs

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/16/bu...9gwgGnYp4ujGdg also http://biz.yahoo.com/nytimes/080617/...348.html?.v=18 and http://www.heraldtribune.com/article...60643&tc=yahoo

Piracy "Reporting"

Quote:

Over the Internet
To report content illegally being offered on a website, newsgroup, auction site, P2P network, FTP site, IRC, Bulleting Board Service (BBC), or elsewhere on the Internet.

http://www.siia.net/piracy/report_content.asp

**Blessedx4** · #2 June 17th, 2008, 01:09 PM

Drudge Retort Episode Highlights 'Fair Use' Uncertainties
http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/200...-is-right.html

Associated Press expects you to pay to license 5-word quotations (and reserves the right to terminate your license)
http://www.boingboing.net/2008/06/17...press-exp.html

The Associated Press wants to charge you $12.50 to quote five words from them
http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight...es/010341.html

**BHiles** · #3 June 17th, 2008, 01:15 PM

The article does not say anything yet.

If this holds true that they will not allow any lines to be quoted and they want summaries then the mods here need to allow for summaries for the news articles where before if they were not a quote of the headline and quotes from the article they ended up in a "chat" or even worse the eternal abyss of anything goes.

**Blessedx4** · #4 June 17th, 2008, 01:18 PM

This forum may go to title and link only with a summary of articles.

**Changes** · #5 June 17th, 2008, 01:23 PM

We will have to work out the kinks...

**BHiles** · #6 June 17th, 2008, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Changes

We will have to work out the kinks...

and the links

**Blessedx4** · #7 June 17th, 2008, 01:27 PM

They are going to publish Guidelines this week on how much can be copied

AP to meet with blogging group to form guidelines
Jun 17, 7:23 AM EDT

http://news.wired.com/dynamic/storie...06-17-07-23-32

AP plans guidelines on how much Web sites can copy
http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/06/...hnology/ap.php

**Changes** · #8 June 17th, 2008, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BHiles

and the links

PlentyGroovy · #9 June 17th, 2008, 01:57 PM

I don't want to click all those links Blessed, could you post the articles please?

I'm kidding.

**Blessedx4** · #10 June 17th, 2008, 01:58 PM

I suspect that AP is going to have a tough time actually enforcing this down to an individual level. They cannot possibly drag every person who quotes or uses their stuff.

But they could go after the sites, groups or Individuals sites that get alot of traffic perhaps?

**Blessedx4** · #11 June 17th, 2008, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlentyGroovy

I don't want to click all those links Blessed, could you post the articles please?

I'm kidding.

PlentyGroovy · #12 June 17th, 2008, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blessedx4

I suspect that AP is going to have a tough time actually enforcing this down to an individual level. They cannot possibly drag every person who quotes or uses their stuff.

But they could go after the sites, groups or Individuals sites that get alot of traffic perhaps?

True, they'd go after the big pockets. If they come after 'plentygroovy', how are they going to find me?

The state versus plentygroovy.

RLB · #13 June 17th, 2008, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blessedx4

I suspect that AP is going to have a tough time actually enforcing this down to an individual level. They cannot possibly drag every person who quotes or uses their stuff.

But they could go after the sites, groups or Individuals sites that get alot of traffic perhaps?

The bloggers are really pushing back at the AP over this. Even boycotting using any AP stories. It may all blow over without any changes. Have to watch and see what happens.

Quote:

The real problem for the A.P. is that it can’t win this argument, and by pressing the issue, they’re very likely to end up with a business model that dies overnight. And I don’t think I’m overstating that. Links are the currency of the Web, and the A.P. hard line spits in the face of that, which is leading to boycotts like Arrington’s. The monopoly co-operative is living in the past, but it needs that past to validate a business model that is as out-of-date as traditional media itself. Now, by pressing the matter, they run the significant risk of being in a contrary legal position, and what will be left for them after that?

They’ve announced that they’re willing to create a new policy, but that, too, is fraught with problems, for it can only shed further light on the weakness of their business model in a changing environment. Bloggers know that links go to the originator of the content, which would mean linking to the A.P.’s members, not the A.P. version thereof. When that happens, media companies will rightly ask why they need an expensive middle man in the equation. Always remember that the Web disrupts the middle of any transaction, including media. As such, the most enviable position in the new world is that of aggregator, but as Google News proves, there’s not exactly a whole lot of money to be made in so doing.

These are all questions that observers have been asking for years, of course, but the A.P.’s own foolish action with what is essentially a small social website have shined a significant spotlight on them all

http://www.thepomoblog.com/archive/t...tifiable-risk/

(I'm not familiar with this particular blog, it was linked from InstaPundit.com)

RLB · #14 June 17th, 2008, 02:22 PM

Can Associated Press control the blogosphere?

Quote:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25198449/

So mark the date kids, this is yet another moment in Internet history we’ll someday look back on in Wikipedia when we scratch our heads and try and figure out how cyber rights and responsibilities got to wherever this whole World Wide Web thing is going.

It all started with a letter from AP (a national news organization that pays the rent by selling news reports of other media, including msnbc.com) to the Drudge Retort (a news aggregator site named in parody for the muckraking site, Drudge Report). AP requested that the Drudge Retort remove seven posts featuring quotes from AP stories. From there, it blew up into yet another full-on Internet conflict between Big Business and the Little Guys.

Similar Google News Links
http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&ne...nG=Search+News

I think that's the real issue. The bloggers print stuff the media would like to keep silenced, so the AP is trying to silence the bloggers. And their tool for doing this is the copyright issue. General consensus is that it will backfire and the AP will lose business for attempting it.

-------------

"AP (a national news organization that pays the rent by selling news reports of other media, including msnbc.com)"

This is something I didn't know. I thought the AP was the one who gathered the news and then sold it to other news media. According to this the AP takes news from one media source then sells it to all the other media sources. They are middlemen, not originators. They can be by-passed.

Wiki Article - Associated Press
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Associated_Press

PlentyGroovy · #15 June 17th, 2008, 02:26 PM

I hope RLB doesn't get in trouble for that quote.

Run RLB run!!

I don't like how old old articles come with a price now because they are archived.

RLB · #16 June 17th, 2008, 02:38 PM

I think it's still safe at least until after they have the guideline meeting.

And none of it was from the Associated Press. Some from blogs, one from MSNBC. But it really does make one stop and think before posting anything now! I would guess probably 75% of any news posted does carry the AP byline. News may be hard to find on sites like PF after this.

**Blessedx4** · #17 June 17th, 2008, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RLB

I think it's still safe at least until after they have the guideline meeting.

And none of it was from the Associated Press. Some from blogs, one from MSNBC. But it really does make one stop and think before posting anything now! I would guess probably 75% of any news posted does carry the AP byline. News may be hard to find on sites like PF after this.

AP is the only one doing this I think.

The mods here are discussing this so haven't decided what to do yet. We'll most likely wait to see the guidelines before changing anything.

This is more or less a heads up.

CaiperLane · #18 June 17th, 2008, 03:03 PM

Yes I responded to this on another section here.

Quote:

On Saturday, The A.P. retreated. Jim Kennedy, vice president and strategy director of The A.P., said in an interview that the news organization had decided that its letter to the Drudge Retort was “heavy-handed” and that The A.P. was going to rethink its policies toward bloggers.

The quick about-face came, he said, because a number of well-known bloggers started criticizing its policy, claiming it would undercut the active discussion of the news that rages on sites, big and small, across the Internet.

I think we need to watch the situation but it seems the AP has backed off. For now.

**Blessedx4** · #19 June 17th, 2008, 03:08 PM

We may tighten how much can be posted however.

This is the way the rule stands right now:

Quote:

No copyrighted material

The posting of articles must be limited to a few opening sentences and the link, for any and all copyrighted material, unless we receive notification from the copyright holder that it may be posted here in full (official Government sites are considered Public Information). This will apply to all material posted here: news articles, commentaries, and pictures. News items and commentaries from subscription based services can not be posted. This includes archived news items that are fee based or require subscriptions as well as for-pay newsletters sent out by various ministries. When in doubt about whether or not something is copyrighted it's best to err on the side of caution or check with the admin team.

If a subscription-based ministry publishes an article 'for all views' (as most do from time to time), we can host it, but if it is released in a regular membership only subscription, we can't.

We do recognize that fair-use allows for the posting of elements of someone's copyrighted material, whether they allow it or not, but we desire as much as possible to keep all our sources verifiable and accessible to all members and to avoid if at all possible any legal entanglements that may result from improper use of the fair-use clause.

Note: Anything published before 1923 is in the Public Domain.

RLB · #20 June 17th, 2008, 03:12 PM

Blessed, this was linked inside one of those links you posted, wirednews, I think. It gives an example of one of the blog entries in question. Looks like it would have been completely acceptable under PF's current rules. Guess I better not repeat the trouble-making entry itself, this is what they said abut it.

Quote:

AP Files 7 DMCA Takedowns Against Drudge Retort

"If you follow the link, you'll see that the blog entry reproduces 18 words from the story and a 32-word quote by Hillary Clinton under a user-written headline."
http://www.cadenhead.org/workbench/n...against-drudge

Quote:

I have no desire to be the third member of that club, but sharing links to news stories of interest has become an essential component of how millions of people read and evaluate the news today. When linking to articles, bloggers commonly include excerpts of the article for the purposes of criticism or discussion. Some AP member sites encourage this kind of reuse. Yahoo News, the source for two disputed stories, invites bloggers to use items from its RSS feeds. USA Today, the source for two others, includes a browser widget alongside articles that facilitates their submission to Digg, Mixx and other sites.

**Blessedx4** · #21 June 20th, 2008, 09:57 AM

The latest on this. (Still no guidelines as of yet)

Responses by Michelle Malkin and others are mentioned here.

also be warned that some are a little peeved by AP and MBA's past relationship so if you read anything from MBA (I read something yesterday and nearly posted it till I learned about this relationship) take it with a grain of salt

AP, bloggers clash over wire content use
Jennifer Harper (Contact)
Friday, June 20, 2008

The ongoing war between the traditional "old" media and Internet-driven "new" media has gotten noisier, with peace and common ground still elusive.

The Associated Press wants bloggers who cite more than four words of any AP story to start paying for it at the rate of $2.50 a word, just like any other news organization.

more.......... http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...-wire-content/

RLB · #22 June 20th, 2008, 10:37 AM

I don't care for that Drudge Retort site, but they do have a story up about it.

AP Settles Dispute with Drudge Retort
Late Thursday night, AP issued the following statement after a day-long discussion of the DMCA takedowns issued to the Drudge Retort that reached all the way up to the company's top management:
http://www.cadenhead.org/workbench/n...-drudge-retort

I'm not gonna quote what AP said, just in case.

Quote:

Cadenhead - "I won't reveal the details of this discussion until AP releases the guidelines for bloggers that it promised on Monday."

This is the Drudge Retort homepage, if anyone's curious. Both the Retort and this Workbench site belong to Cadenhead.
http://www.drudge.com/