Judas in paradise or hell.

[Kendall Crawfor]

Reading Acts 1:20 caused me to consider the fate of Judas.
Is Peter telling the rest of the brethern that Judas sealed his fate as foretold by King David in the Pslams 69. Did his betrayal of Christ condemn him to hell or was it his choice of suicide. Or his he forgiven?

[IbeleiveinJesus]

If he was condemned, (and I think he was) what caused him to be condemned was the same thing that causes everyone else to be condemned, and that is the rejection of Jesus Christ as his Savior.

-Ted

[Hootmon]

Joh 17:12 "While I was with them, I was keeping them in Your name which You have given Me; and I guarded them and not one of them perished but the son of perdition, so that the Scripture would be fulfilled.

[TruthGiver]

I suppose only the Lord know for sure, but from what I have learned about Judas I believe he was not saved. He was known for stealing from the money in which he was intrusted by Jesus. He showed greed when he rebuked Mary for annointing Jesus feet with oil. In other words I never saw that he beared good fruit and that was before this:

John 13:21When Jesus had thus said, he was troubled in spirit, and testified, and said, Verily, verily, I say unto you, that one of you shall betray me. 13:22Then the disciples looked one on another, doubting of whom he spake. 13:23Now there was leaning on Jesus' bosom one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved. 13:24Simon Peter therefore beckoned to him, that he should ask who it should be of whom he spake. 13:25He then lying on Jesus' breast saith unto him, Lord, who is it? 13:26Jesus answered, He it is, to whom I shall give a sop, when I have dipped it. And when he had dipped the sop, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon. 13:27And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

As God knows all things, I believe he knew the heart of Judas and that he would not accept Jesus as his savior so he used him to fullfil his purpose.

[IbeleiveinJesus]

As God knows all things, I believe he knew the heart of Judas and that he would not accept Jesus as his savior so he used him to fullfil his purpose.

I agree, and think we see that in different places in the Gospels.. such as the woman at the well.. or when addressing the Pharisees, where our Lord not only responds to the verbal questions put to him.. but also seems to know the intentions and the thoughts of those he is talking too..

-Ted

[trn2him]

I have wondered about this also.

I have always wondered, If Satan was allowed to indwell inside of Judas, it wasn't his choice. His suicide showed me he was in terrible grief about what he had done, so did he repent and was he saved?

I'm know I'm probably way off, logic and scripture knowledge tells me he is in hell but my heart tells me he could have been saved.

[Hootmon]

Judas, the son of perdition (apōleia), perished (apollumi).

IMO, he was not saved...

[kgreen20]

He could have been, yes, as Peter was. (Peter denied Jesus 3 times, yet he was forgiven--Judas could have been, too.) Sadly, he wasn't.

[allforHim]

Did God keep his heart hard or did he know it wouldnt be swayed by walking with Jesus? IMO it would be impossibe to stay an unbeliever while spending time with Jesus! Seeing His miracles and stuff. I mean how hard can a heart get? Was his heart cold or was he deceived into to thinking something else was happening?

[Kendall Crawfor]

Judas, the son of perdition (apōleia), perished (apollumi).

IMO, he was not saved...

I think that is the best answer.

[zhan]

Did God keep his heart hard or did he know it wouldnt be swayed by walking with Jesus? IMO it would be impossibe to stay an unbeliever while spending time with Jesus! Seeing His miracles and stuff. I mean how hard can a heart get? Was his heart cold or was he deceived into to thinking something else was happening?

During the millennium, Jesus will be on earth reigning and Satan will be locked up, and *still* there will be people who fall. One thing about it, it certainly takes away the whole "Devil made me do it" excuse.

[Lurkinguy]

I have wondered about this also.

I have always wondered, If Satan was allowed to indwell inside of Judas, it wasn't his choice. His suicide showed me he was in terrible grief about what he had done, so did he repent and was he saved?

I'm know I'm probably way off, logic and scripture knowledge tells me he is in hell but my heart tells me he could have been saved.Only God Knows, but this seems at least possible.
Could Judas have known Jesus was the Messiah? Yes.
Judas may have been hoping to force Jesus into the role of "Conquering King" instead of "Meek Servant".
He may have been confused by the dual roles in prophesy concerning Jesus.
Judas was obviously extremely remorseful about his actions while still alive, so who can say?

[Lurkinguy]

One thing about it, it certainly takes away the whole "Devil made me do it" excuse.:lol That's for sure. :lol

[DakotaRose]

I think he was not saved. It was not just that satan entered Judas, because we see he was stealing from the money bag before that, showing what kind of person he was all along. I honestly don't think it was one sin or another that caused him to perish, but the sin of not accepting Jesus. After all, THAT is what sends one to hell, if one dies without accepting Jesus.

[VeilLifted]

During the millennium, Jesus will be on earth reigning and Satan will be locked up, and *still* there will be people who fall. One thing about it, it certainly takes away the whole "Devil made me do it" excuse.

The millenial kingdom emphasizes is the fact that man cannot on his own stand, when Satan is re-released after the 1000 years is over. Man fell in the garden, failed to keep the covenants, failed in human government and will fall again when Satan is unbound even after a perfect reign under Christ Jesus in his MK. It is proof that man is sinful and falls easily without our Great Lord & Savior to pave our way to Heaven.

Satan challenged God in this when he accused Job of being loyal to God because God blessed him with prosperity in reward for Job's righteousness.
God allowed Satan to take all possessions away and Job remained faithful.

Satan again challenged God by saying God has blessed Job with health, why wouldnt he remain faithful to God. God allowed Satan to affect Job's health with boils over his entire body and Job remained righteous in not cursing God, even at the cajoling statements by his 3 friends.

This proves that only under God's perfect will and hand can man ever truly stand in His presence.

[BobTheBuilder]

To me it depends on the version of Judas' death we're looking at.

If we look at Matthew (I think) we see Judas return the bribe and hang himself out of guilt. To me that implies repentance, and remorse for what he has done. He seems to be aware of the enormity of his actions and cannot bear to live any longer.

If we follow Acts, then Judas simply buys some land and is split open upon the ground. This appears to be an act of God and thus Judas may have been unrepentant.

...actually I have a question...

How do we reconcile the differneces in the stories of Judas fate presented in Acts and Matthew. Judas either kept the money or he didn't, which makes the two stories mutually exclusive. He either hanged himself or was struck down on land that he purchased.

[allforHim]

:confused It has to be one or the other, they cant both be right like in some other gospel verses............not sure about that one. :(: Maybe theres historical evidence to prove he bought a field. More chance of that than proving he gave the money back.

[Lurkinguy]

How do we reconcile the differneces in the stories of Judas fate presented in Acts and Matthew. Judas either kept the money or he didn't, which makes the two stories mutually exclusive. He either hanged himself or was struck down on land that he purchased.I don't believe there is a contradiction, just probably a different view of the same event. I think that Matthew describes Judas suicide by hanging and Luke talks about his falling headlong and bursting open. It wouldn't take long for a body to decompose in the heat (and I'll spare all the disgusting details) and eventually the body would be brought down (by cutting the rope or it coming loose or whatever) and the body might bust open.
Matthew records the method of judas death, and Luke records the end result.
Two different views of the same thing, I suppose. It's kind of like seeing it in stereo. Only my opinion and your mileage may vary....

[DMac]

Mat 26:24 The Son of man goeth as it is written of him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! it had been good for that man if he had not been born.

[BobTheBuilder]

I don't believe there is a contradiction, just probably a different view of the same event. I think that Matthew describes Judas suicide by hanging and Luke talks about his falling headlong and bursting open. It wouldn't take long for a body to decompose in the heat (and I'll spare all the disgusting details) and eventually the body would be brought down (by cutting the rope or it coming loose or whatever) and the body might bust open.
Matthew records the method of judas death, and Luke records the end result.
Two different views of the same thing, I suppose. It's kind of like seeing it in stereo. Only my opinion and your mileage may vary....

But what about the money?? Either he kept it and spent it, or returned it. The only reason for returning it would be guilt for his actions.

Also I think the verse where he bursts open explains the he bursts open in the field (The Field of blood) that he buys.

[zhan]

One of the many sites that answered the alleged Bible Contradictions:
http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/bible.htm#INDEX

Here are the entries for your specific question:
Death of Judas - http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/bible.htm#79
Who purchased the field - http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/bible.htm#80

Lots of other stuff answered there as well, if you're interested.

[alabama35565]

As God knows all things, I believe he knew the heart of Judas and that he would not accept Jesus as his savior so he used him to fullfil his purpose.



i'm going to wander slightly off topic here but will tie it in with this post above.

the Bible tells us that God has known us since before we were born , the very number of the hairs on our heads, where we will live and when we will die.......would this not also imply that our Lord Saviour also knows which ones of us will become His children and which will not......which ones hearts will be harden and which will not?

could that be the reason why He is tarrying so long about coming back, to give each and everyone of us that chance to make the final decision?

[Jany]

could that be the reason why He is tarrying so long about coming back, to give each and everyone of us that chance to make the final decision? Too late, after one dies, yeah? <><

[Jany]

Doesn't Scripture say that the devil entered into Judas? How does the devil enter into one when they are Believers? How can the devil and the Holy Spirit endwel the same vessel? :confused <><

[Hootmon]

How can the devil and the Holy Spirit endwel the same vessel? :confused <><IMO, they cant

[Jany]

IMO, they cant
Didn't think so ;): <><

[tygerkittn]

The Holy Spirit didn't come until Pentecost.

[alabama35565]

Too late, after one dies, yeah? <><


i know it is to late after one dies. that was not what i was referring to.

[SJC72]

Hi Guys,

I just thought I would jump in with possibly some helpful info to address this subject.
First of all in Matthew 23:7 we are told that Judas "repented himself". Whenever repentance is used in the context of salvation it is always with the greek word Metanoia (which literally translates to change ones mind). The greek word used in the Matthew passage is metamelomai which simply means "regret". This is not the repentance that leads to salvation. So Judas was not saved.

Now to the apparent contradiction of Matthew 27:5, "And he went away and hanged himself", and Acts 1:18, "falling headlong he burst asunder"....To properly understand this situation, first we need to examine jewish law of the day. Judas committed suicide at the end of the first night of Passover, before the first day of Passover when the morning sacrifice would be offered (of which only the priesthood would partake). According to jewish law, if there was a dead body in Jerusalem, then the city was to be considered defiled, and the morning sacrifice could not be offered.
However, jewish law states that if the corpse is taken and cast into the valley of Hinnom, a place of burning, then the city is cleansed and the Passover can be offered up. Later they could return and bury the body.

When Judas hanged himself within Jerusalem he caused the city to become defiled, and in doing so, prevented the morning sacrifice from being offered. According to the law of the day, Judas' body would have taken and cast into the valley of Hinnom, thereby cleansing the city. This is the fall of Judas' body as decribed in Acts 1:18.

As far as the money situation...the 30 pieces of silver was considered "blood money" and in accordance with jewish law, could not be accepted by the Rabbi's into the temple treasury. So this begs a question...What were they to do with the money?

They basically had 2 options--1) Return the money to the original owner
2) Use it for public good

Obviously option 1 was impossible, so the priests had to spend it in some way for the public good. They purchased a field in the valley of Hinnom (the same place where Judas had burst asunder) for the purpose of burying strangers. In fact the first person buried there was Judas.

The book of Matthew tells us that the Chief priests purchased Potter's field, while Acts states that Judas did. This is no contradiction (the bible NEVER contradicts itself!). In accordance with Jewish law, the field had to be purchased Posthumously in the name of Judas. This is why it states that Judas "obtained a field". Technically, the Chief Priests were just the "purchasing agents".

Hope that helps.

[LostAndFound]

Mat 26:24 The Son of man goeth as it is written of him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! it had been good for that man if he had not been born.

All this debate about whether he is in hell and yet doesn't that verse clearly spell it out?

[Kendall Crawfor]

I thought as hootman but in Revelation 21:14 tells us that the names of the the 12 apostles are written in the 12 foundations of the new heaven. Which could mean Judas or his successor in ACTs 1.

[Hootmon]

Hope that helps.Good post.

[Hootmon]

I thought as hootman but in Revelation 21:14 tells us that the names of the the 12 apostles are written in the 12 foundations of the new heaven. Which could mean Judas or his successor in ACTs 1.His successor, IMO. No way to be 100% certain, but it seems unlikely that someone of Judas' description (son of perdition/destruction) would be considered a 'foundation stone' of New Jerusalem.

[Hootmon]

The Holy Spirit didn't come until Pentecost.The HS was present before that. It was just manifested differently. On an individual basis as opposed to the post-Pentacost 'corporate' basis.

[Stranger Savedby]

Interesting thread. Is it biblical that Judas could of accepted Jesus, after the cross, where Jesus set the captives free? (Gehena sp?)

[kgreen20]

Not once he was dead, no. It was too late, then. He could have accepted Jesus after the cross if he had not killed himself first, though.

[Stranger Savedby]

Not once he was dead, no. It was too late, then. He could have accepted Jesus after the cross if he had not killed himself first, though.

Sorry I do not understand. Does Gods grace stop at suicide?

[kgreen20]

It does if you die without receiving Jesus' gift of forgiveness. As Judas did, sad to say. We know he did, because of what Jesus Himself said about him. In the Gospel of John, He called Judas the "son of perdition," whom He lost. In the other gospels (I can't remember, off hand, which ones), He said "woe" to Judas, because Judas was going to betray Him, and then He said it would have been better if Judas had never been born. In killing himself, Judas sealed his own fate, because he died without first receiving Jesus' forgiveness. He could have been forgiven, as Peter was, had he received it.

[warrior-child]

Judas returned the money; stating that he basically killed an innocent MAN, he didn't recognize Jesus as His personal Lord and Savior ... he hung himself out of a false guilt ... not a conviction of the Holy Spirit that leads to repentance and a turning away from sin ... He did it his way ... just my thoughts here ... Peter went and wept bitterly in true remorse and under the conviction of the Holy Spirit ... he didn't end his life ... discouraged? Yes ... but oh what God may do with a truely repentive and willing heart! Peter's pride was totally broken and He was never the same ...