May a divorced man become a leader of a church?

[MKLevesque]

Of course, I am referencing 1 Timothy 3. There are very few subjects regarding scripture that I haven't developed a stong belief of, but this is one of them. Please let me know what you scripturally believe.

[Funmudder]

There are alot of variables, I would need more details.

Like if he was divorced because he kept cheating on his wife and has yet to even consider repenting, then I would say, no.
But then that would be different from a man whose first marriage failed but since then he has grown closer to the Lord, repented of his own faults in the marriage and is now a changed man, then sure.

I don't see why any one sin would prevent us from anything in the future if we have turned our lives around, repented and sought forgiveness. We are made new.

[Teardrops]

I don't see why any one sin would prevent us from anything in the future if we have turned our lives around, repented and sought forgiveness. We are made new.

Agreed :thumb

[boxer77]

Well Charles Stanley is divorced, and he is still preaching.

[Gail 55]

It says somewhere in N.T. that to be a leader or deacon--the man must be the hsband of one woman. The way I have heard this explained means--- not because your divorced ---but that you must be the husband of one wife at one time. No harem lol in other words. Dont know if this is true or not.

[MKLevesque]

Here is a more direct question. Does the definition of husband of one wife mentioned in 1 Timothy 3 mean:

1. Not divorced and remarried (probably most often used in conservative circles).
2. Not widowed and remarried.
3. Not more than one wife at a time (polygamy).
4. Must be married to hold the position (no single people may hold position).
5. Position is limited to a man, since the position requires that one must be a husband of one wife.

No offense to anyone is meant by the following statement (although it will probable offend someone...)

I am only interested in replies with scriptural references. Examples of individuals who are currently divorced, but still preaching are irrelevant to me because I don't feel they address the topic. I believe all Christians are called to preach, spread the gospel, etc., but there is a difference between preaching the Word of God and shepherding a flock of God's sheep. I can appreciate that Charles Stanley may be an excellent preacher, but if any person does not meet the biblical requirements to hold a leadership position in the church then they should not be in that position.

Thanks in advance for all responses.

[Jany]

Well Charles Stanley is divorced, and he is still preaching. So true, and I believe he is such a man of God, so his divorce wouldn't stop me from attending his church or listening to him on TV, etc... <><

[scrappergirl]

There are alot of scriptural mandates for church leaders. In order to be a pastor, the pastor's children must be well behaved (thats not an exact quote, but i can find the scripture if you want me to) among other things. So if there are any leaders/pastors out there whose kids aren't saved and are living a life of rebellion, then biblically, they shouldn't be pastors. Would make for pretty slim pickings, I'd think.

[BHiles]

Bishops (pastors) are to be:
I Timothy 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach; 3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; 4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; 5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?) 6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil. 7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

Deacons are to be:
I Timothy 3:8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre; 9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience. 10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless. 11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things. 12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well. 13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Gifts and callings can still be use but a person can be disqualified from the office or position based on failure to meet these creiteria. Ths is no judgement but a protection for the church. It is wrong for a church to allow a person to have these particular positions within the church if they fail to meet the criteria.

This does not mean that one who would fail the criteria is not wanted and needed to fulfill many useful roles within the local body. Indeed they can be even of more value than a person with the title. They can preach and teach. They can serve and exhibit both gifts and fruit. Not only they can but they should.

This is not a judgement call. God has not been quiet nor buried these qualifications in some obscure Bible code. It is what it is and says what it says whether it is agreed upon or not. And furthermore anecdotal evidence in which lightening did not strike one disobedient to God's rules does not nullify them but only shows a patient, grace filled God to a disobedient people.

[Dear2HIM]

Bishops (pastors) are to be:
I Timothy 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach; 3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; 4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; 5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?) 6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil. 7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

Deacons are to be:
I Timothy 3:8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre; 9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience. 10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless. 11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things. 12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well. 13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Gifts and callings can still be use but a person can be disqualified from the office or position based on failure to meet these creiteria. Ths is no judgement but a protection for the church. It is wrong for a church to allow a person to have these particular positions within the church if they fail to meet the criteria.

This does not mean that one who would fail the criteria is not wanted and needed to fulfill many useful roles within the local body. Indeed they can be even of more value than a person with the title. They can preach and teach. They can serve and exhibit both gifts and fruit. Not only they can but they should.

This is not a judgement call. God has not been quiet nor buried these qualifications in some obscure Bible code. It is what it is and says what it says whether it is agreed upon or not. And furthermore anecdotal evidence in which lightening did not strike one disobedient to God's rules does not nullify them but only shows a patient, grace filled God to a disobedient people.

BHiles,
This is an uncomfortable subject, but I can't help but agree that the bible seems strait forward regarding this. I've looked at from other angles, listened to many sermons trying to teach it differently. Although I'd rather believe (in my human thinking) that it is ok to remain in office while not fulfilling these qualifications...I don't see how it lines up scripturally.

Seminary or higher learning in the greek sense is not mentioned, but having a family that is well maintained, is. :noidea

[scrappergirl]

I can't disagree with you bhiles...but...my discomfort comes when considering the behavior of those we cannot control...our kids. (oh, and thanks for doing the work i was too lazy to do and posting the scripture).

point being...if the pastor/deacon/leader in question meets all of the qualifications and then the kids turn bad (how many devout and wonderful christian parents have had their kids just totally rebel?) or the wife end up cheating on them, etc., well, do they get kicked out for something they're not guilty of?

not trying to be argumentative...just trying to wrap my brains around it. ya know?

[BHiles]

I can't disagree with you bhiles...but...my discomfort comes when considering the behavior of those we cannot control...our kids. (oh, and thanks for doing the work i was too lazy to do and posting the scripture).

point being...if the pastor/deacon/leader in question meets all of the qualifications and then the kids turn bad (how many devout and wonderful christian parents have had their kids just totally rebel?) or the wife end up cheating on them, etc., well, do they get kicked out for something they're not guilty of?

not trying to be argumentative...just trying to wrap my brains around it. ya know?

If the leadership were to hold a view of position as one in which they must hold onto in order to do the work of the gospel then their motivations are further out of place than even the incident which disqualified them. We must remember that the local church body is Christ's. He mad the rules and we must just follow. God has a way of working these things out for His glory but only in our obedience to His word. It is wrong to hold on to postion so desperately that we disobey God's explicit instruction. It shows a faithlessness in God and a serious lack of desire of rHis will above our own. God is more about His kingdom work than a postion that is held. The best thing a leader can do to exhibit God in his life is to obey God, step down and fall in line and continue the work that God will have for him. It may even be a greater work we don't know but we must trust that God knows what He is doing with his church.

It is just as easy for God to have taken that child or adulterous spouse home also. So we must trust He is in control in all things.

[MKLevesque]

The original question is what is the scriptural definition of husband of one wife?

[scrappergirl]

mkl,
sorry for taking it off topic, but, i guess i took it as if you're going to use the law, then you have to use the WHOLE law.

i had another comment/question about your reply, but, since you want to keep the topic on only that one point of the law, i'll :tape.

[BHiles]

The original question is what is the scriptural definition of husband of one wife?

To answer you second question 1, 3, 4, and 5 are correct in order to hold either position.

Death always has anulled the marriage.


Divorce breaks several of the qualifications for position of Deacon and Bishop.

[MKLevesque]

To answer you second question 1, 3, 4, and 5 are correct in order to hold either position.

Death always has anulled the marriage.


Divorce breaks several of the qualifications for position of Deacon and Bishop.

Definitely not an answer I expected. I thought either/or, not multiple answers. I will have to ponder this. Thanks for your response.

[MKLevesque]

mkl,
sorry for taking it off topic, but, i guess i took it as if you're going to use the law, then you have to use the WHOLE law.

i had another comment/question about your reply, but, since you want to keep the topic on only that one point of the law, i'll :tape.

I am pretty comfortable with the other qualifications, but I am definitely interested in hearing all you have to say. Thanks a bunch for your input.

[bopeep1909]

Well Charles Stanley is divorced, and he is still preaching.

Yes, but he has not remarried. He hasn't had 5 wives.<><

[scrappergirl]

I guess my point was this:
If I am a godly person, trying to do what God has called me to do, and, through no fault of my own, my spouse cheats on me or my grown child rebels in some way, would/should I walk away from whatever leadership position I may be in? (obviously, this is all conjecture, since I am a girl and can't be a pastor or deacon).


Assuming you are asking the OP because you are divorced and feeling called to a leadership position in your church, if you end up believing that your previous divorce doesn't disqualify you, but you have a grown child (pretend you do, if you don't) who is living in some sort of sin/rebellion, would that or would that not negate your other attributes and calling to the position? (also assuming that you are not aspiring toward leadership in a vain or prideful way, but with the heart of a servant).

I hope i was able to make that thought clear. Its much clearer in my head than in print.
:):

[boxer77]

Yes, but he has not remarried. He hasn't had 5 wives.<><
I didnt know he didnt remarry.

[Dear2HIM]

I guess my point was this:
If I am a godly person, trying to do what God has called me to do, and, through no fault of my own, my spouse cheats on me or my grown child rebels in some way, would/should I walk away from whatever leadership position I may be in? (obviously, this is all conjecture, since I am a girl and can't be a pastor or deacon).


Assuming you are asking the OP because you are divorced and feeling called to a leadership position in your church, if you end up believing that your previous divorce doesn't disqualify you, but you have a grown child (pretend you do, if you don't) who is living in some sort of sin/rebellion, would that or would that not negate your other attributes and calling to the position? (also assuming that you are not aspiring toward leadership in a vain or prideful way, but with the heart of a servant).

I hope i was able to make that thought clear. Its much clearer in my head than in print.
:):

I can't imagine that this passage means grown children. That would be a stretch. It says "children" and refers to his household. That is my understanding.

[Kem]

If the leadership were to hold a view of position as one in which they must hold onto in order to do the work of the gospel then their motivations are further out of place than even the incident which disqualified them. We must remember that the local church body is Christ's. He mad the rules and we must just follow. God has a way of working these things out for His glory but only in our obedience to His word. It is wrong to hold on to postion so desperately that we disobey God's explicit instruction. It shows a faithlessness in God and a serious lack of desire of rHis will above our own. God is more about His kingdom work than a postion that is held. The best thing a leader can do to exhibit God in his life is to obey God, step down and fall in line and continue the work that God will have for him. It may even be a greater work we don't know but we must trust that God knows what He is doing with his church.

It is just as easy for God to have taken that child or adulterous spouse home also. So we must trust He is in control in all things.

You know I think this thread should almost be considered in parallell with the one on what does it mean to fear God. We can all have our opinions and ideas on what is good and fair and right in our own views but the only thing that matters is what does God say.

[boxer77]

You know I think this thread should almost be considered in parallell with the one on what does it mean to fear God. We can all have our opinions and ideas on what is good and fair and right in our own views but the only thing that matters is what does God say.

:nod :clap

[scrappergirl]

point taken, maybe adult children are moot...although then we're still looking at the age of accountability, which is different from child to child. and it still doesn't cover the sin of a spouse, though. we can't control what our spouses do...so what about the case of the spouse? :confused

[Dear2HIM]

point taken, maybe adult children are moot...although then we're still looking at the age of accountability, which is different from child to child. and it still doesn't cover the sin of a spouse, though. we can't control what our spouses do...so what about the case of the spouse? :confused


why are we talking about the age of accountability? :confused

According to this passage in discussion, an elder should step down if his children are rebellious. I know of pastors who I wished the elders would have given a leave of absence to take care of their families. It would have been more caring than to allow him to lead a flock while his family falls apart.

It's kingdom thinking versus the church/business model we tend to think of (because it's what we've known for umpteen years).

[Dear2HIM]

Adding that the Church body should expect that the Holy Spirit will equipt that group with the giftings necessary to work according to God's will for the Church as taught in scripture. It would be exciting to be relying on God more and see what He makes of us when we lean on Him and walk in obedience expecting Him to do what He says He would do. I think it would be exciting to be around a group of believers who do this. :):

[macpreacher]

In response to BHiles. Great Godly answers.
Scripture is and should be our final authority and not feelings.
1Tim. 3 and Titus need to be read just as they are written and not by emotional means. Manage a household well is about a man's entire household not just his children as he is the preist in his home.
The husband of one wife is one living wife.

[soprano]

In response to BHiles. Great Godly answers.
Scripture is and should be our final authority and not feelings.
1Tim. 3 and Titus need to be read just as they are written and not by emotional means.

:thumb

deb

[scrappergirl]

why are we talking about the age of accountability?

if a person in authority is otherwise worthy to hold such a position but will be scrutinized bc of his spouse and or children (as pointed out, his not-grown children), then i would think their age would play into it.
but perhaps i am just being thick headed, since it doesn't seem that I am having the same conversation as anyone else here. :lol

guess i am just getting caught up on situations that i have seen where good christian parents end up with not so good christian kids. or spouses.

just ignore me....bc i am evidently making no sense this weekend. :wacko

[scrappergirl]

ok, dear2him,
i just re read your response, and i think i understand it a little better....although those who are from tiny churches would see alot of leaders stepping down with scant amount of willing people to fill their shoes.

i mean, yes, i agree, if you can't keep yer house in order, then how can you keep God's house in order...but...eh. fugeddaboudit. i am muddying the waters here.
:wave

[Paul Merritt]

Ok. On the issue of a scriptural meaning of 'A husband of one wife' I am pretty certain that this means:

1. Must be a man.
2. Must be married to a woman.
3. Must NOT be married to more than one woman.
4. Must not have gotten divorced, UNLESS there is biblical justification for it. (adultery by wife, or unbelieving wife who leaves him.)

Now comes the sticky part. What about a man who was divorced before becoming saved? After all these things were done in ignorance, and are covered by grace. And he is now 'a new creature'. In a very real way, it was another man who divorced his ex wife (or wives). any opinions on this?

[Dear2HIM]

Ok. On the issue of a scriptural meaning of 'A husband of one wife' I am pretty certain that this means:

1. Must be a man.
2. Must be married to a woman.
3. Must NOT be married to more than one woman.
4. Must not have gotten divorced, UNLESS there is biblical justification for it. (adultery by wife, or unbelieving wife who leaves him.)

Now comes the sticky part. What about a man who was divorced before becoming saved? After all these things were done in ignorance, and are covered by grace. And he is now 'a new creature'. In a very real way, it was another man who divorced his ex wife (or wives). any opinions on this?

I don't see any biblical reference to that situation SPECIFICALLY, so my response would be the Church elders would seek the Holy Spirit's guidance in prayer over that situation.

[paw]

I don't see any biblical reference to that situation SPECIFICALLY, so my response would be the Church elders would seek the Holy Spirit's guidance in prayer over that situation.

I hate moles.

[Dear2HIM]

I hate moles.


:cry

you must be saying that because you had a bad day.

Your forgiven :hug hope tomorrow is brighter.





:heh

[bopeep1909]

I didnt know he didnt remarry.

Not to my knowledge.<><