remarriage in God's eyes....

[SetApart]

ok..tough question here..in a LOT of ways..

a friend of mine :thumb was married to her first husband for several years...she had enough of the issues in their marriage to the point that she filed for divorce and got it finalized. she knows that divorce is a sin and as it leads to "adultery" with another person should they remarry.

she finally got remarried several years after her divorce, and the "adultery" issue still haunts her even though she has repented about her divorce.

how does God view remarriage and intimacy with a new spouse after divorce and repentance from that divorce....???? i could pass these messages on to her :):

[B A N E]

In CC & BS:
Search: Divorce, Remarriage

[RevJeff]

Personally, I believe we have in church circles made divorcees second class citizens for to long. Any sin can be forgiven, even divorce.

[CINDY S.]

There is only one unforgivable sin.




Mat 12:31 ¶ Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy [against] the [Holy] Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

[LivnForChrist]

Amen RevJeff and Cindy. Look, God forgives our sins when we repent of them and ask forgiveness. Repentence from a past divorce doesnt necessarily mean to divorce the person you're with and try to remarry your ex. God has forgiven your friend. The only thing she can do now is to just serve God and enjoy her present marriage.

[HeartlandGal]

Amen RevJeff and Cindy. Look, God forgives our sins when we repent of them and ask forgiveness. Repentence from a past divorce doesnt necessarily mean to divorce the person you're with and try to remarry your ex. God has forgiven your friend. The only thing she can do now is to just serve God and enjoy her present marriage.

But, do most Christians actually believe that divorce is a sin? I know many agree that it is not a good thing, but I don't think many actually see it as a sin, and therefore many don't see remarriage after a divorce as a sin either.

[Prodical Son]

I am divorced. In the book of Matthew, Jesus gives one exceptable reason for divorce, adultry. Even if this is not the reason the person got divorced, if they truely repent, God will forgive them. It is finished. As for remarrage, if the divorce is forgiven then it is forgotten (finished). God tells us that when he forgives us he forgets are transgressions. I believe as long as they put God first in the new marrage and summit to each other, no problem. My opinion.

[LivnForChrist]

But, do most Christians actually believe that divorce is a sin? I know many agree that it is not a good thing, but I don't think many actually see it as a sin, and therefore many don't see remarriage after a divorce as a sin either.I dont know what most christians believe but yes, save for adultery...to divorce is a sin but as stated before, its not unforgivable.

[boxer77]

What I see here is, if you repent for remarrying and you go on staying remarried you are living in a sinful relationship in Gods eyes, the relationship with that other person dosent cease to be adultry and ok. Thats like a homosexual saying ok God I repent of this sinful life style but they stay in that relationship.
I think this world and Christians alike want things on their terms cause its easier.
When one truly repents of sin, you turn the other way, not stick around in a marriage not supported by Gods word.
Other than one getting remarried beacuse one of the spouses had an affair, remarrige is a adulterous affair, weather or not people want to see it that way.

[LivnForChrist]

I see your point but its not same as homosexuality. Homosexuals will never be "married" in Gods eyes.

[LivnForChrist]

Another thing is it depends on if she married/divorced her ex before she got saved.

[boxer77]

Sin is sin in Gods eyes. Weather it be a homsexual relationship, or a heterosexual adulterous relationship.
So a heterosexual adultery relationship, is just one sin when it first happens then its ok after that?:confused
That dosent make sense.

[LivnForChrist]

Sin is sin in Gods eyes. Weather it be a homsexual relationship, or a heterosexual adulterous relationship.That is true. But marriage is a sanctified and ordained relationship of God between 2 people. Homosexuality is not therefore its a bad example. :):

[boxer77]

Another thing is it depends on if she married/divorced her ex before she got saved.

That dosent matter, thats like saying Gods word has a loop hole.

[boxer77]

That is true. But marriage is a sanctified and ordained relationship of God between 2 people. Homosexuality is not therefore its a bad example. :):

An adulterous affiar is not ordained by God, you commit adultery the full leangth of the marriage, if you marry out of Gods boundries.
If homsexuality dosent float your boat, then we can use a man and woman living togeather fornicating, they say God forgive us for living like this we repent, we dont want to get married like your word says but we love each other and that is enough.
They are still fornicating.

[LivnForChrist]

Then my marriage is adulterous by your view. My hubbie is divorced. He was a sinner and she was saved. He left her and later married me, another sinner. We both got saved and have 4 kids together. His ex has since remarried. Is he still bound to her boxer? BTW, I'm not being argumentative. I'm just asking. I appreciate your input. :):

[boxer77]

Its not my view its what Gods word says. Is there exception to sin? if we wernt saved before we were born again it is it still sin? Yes. Being born again is true repentance, marrige is still God ordained even if you arnt a believer.
Say your husband is having an affair, and he tells you Im sorry, and dosent even say he will stop the affair, but he asks you to forgive him, is that a sincere apology, is that quiting the adulterous affair? When teh adultry stops is when that relationship stops.

[LivnForChrist]

I appreciate that boxer I really do but as for me personally, I've been with my hubbie for 22 years. I'm not about to run for the divorce lawyer. I understand what you're saying though.

[Gary]

What I see here is, if you repent for remarrying and you go on staying remarried you are living in a sinful relationship in Gods eyes, the relationship with that other person dosent cease to be adultry and ok. Thats like a homosexual saying ok God I repent of this sinful life style but they stay in that relationship....


So....after you repent, you should then divorce your second wife too??? To make up for the sin of marrying her in the first place???:confused

[boxer77]

I appreciate that boxer I really do but as for me personally, I've been with my hubbie for 22 years. I'm not about to run for the divorce lawyer. I understand what you're saying though.

Amen, God Bless.

[boxer77]

So....after you repent, you should then divorce your second wife too??? To make up for the sin of marrying her in the first place???:confused

The marriage was never ordained by God, the one that was adulterous.
Thats like saying dont sin, but keep in the sinful relationship, if God dosent approve of that marriage why would He condem for leaving it?

[B A N E]

< :mod hat on >

Reason this one out, it's not difficult:

Step 1: Unlawful divorce of first marriage..."not really a divorce"
Step 2: Remarriage IF it equals adultery, it by definition nullifies the first.
Step 3: Therefore, the first marriage is now legally ended.
There is no way around this result.

Remarriage does not equal "continual adultery".
If this line of thought is pursued, those that push it will be banned from
this thread. If they pursue it further, they will be banned from RRMB.

I am not playing.

Link to a 2yr old post/study of mine:
http://www.rr-bb.com/showthread.php?p=1854753#post1854753

[boxer77]

I dont see how a continual adulterous relationship could be equaled out, sin gets equaled out by repentance and forgiveness.
When does the adultry turn into- not adultry? this makes no sense.

[LivnForChrist]

Thanks Bane (not that I want to see Boxer banned), the way you
put it makes sense.

[Gary]

The marriage was never ordained by God, the one that was adulterous.
Thats like saying dont sin, but keep in the sinful relationship, if God dosent approve of that marriage why would He condem for leaving it?


So, if divorce is a sin, then two wrongs make a right???

[Gary]

"Now on to the marriage/divorce issue.
This is aimed straight at the events of Ezra/Nehemiah and the abandonment
of the foreign wives & children."

This is the absolute best explanation I have ever seen. Well said Bane.:thumb

[ZeroHour]

I am divorced. In the book of Matthew, Jesus gives one exceptable reason for divorce, adultry. Even if this is not the reason the person got divorced, if they truely repent, God will forgive them. It is finished. As for remarrage, if the divorce is forgiven then it is forgotten (finished). God tells us that when he forgives us he forgets are transgressions. I believe as long as they put God first in the new marrage and summit to each other, no problem. My opinion.

That is a great response. But I still can't figure out why the Lord said that beatings weren't an acceptable reason for a divorce. I don't get it.

[B A N E]

I dont see how a continual adulterous relationship could be equaled out, sin gets equaled out by repentance and forgiveness.
When does the adultry turn into- not adultry? this makes no sense.

It makes perfect sense.

By the Law:
Remarriage/Adultery ends the first marriage.
There is no longer a first marriage in existence.

[fefeh]

Divorce is the sin.

I have repented of that sin, and if my current husband divorces me, I will not remarry until both exes are no longer living.

I am one with my husband, and God does not want another divorce(sin) to happen. It would tear apart our family (again). :(:

Doesn't it say somewhere in the Bible that once a spouse has been put away (divorced), to not go back to that person? I can't look it up right now, but will try to later.

[boxer77]

No 2 wrongs make 2 wrongs. I want to know when one commits adultery by remarrying after divorcing for the wrong reasons, ceases to commit adultry?
Im gonna pray about it, mabey the Lord will open my eyes to somthing IM not seeing.
I dont get Banes breakdown.

[B A N E]

nix that...

READ what I wrote.
Adultery, the act, the singular act of sleeping with the other person
ENDS the first marriage.

Afterwards, it is not adultery, the first marriage is dead, gone, nonexistent.
Therefore, it cannot be adultery.

[RevJeff]

I dont see how a continual adulterous relationship could be equaled out, sin gets equaled out by repentance and forgiveness.
When does the adultry turn into- not adultry? this makes no sense.

Ever read 1 John 1:9?

Since Paul says no adulterer will enter the kingdom of heaven, by your line of reasoning that means no person who has remarried can get into heaven. That's not what God intended. Any sin can be forgiven.

[boxer77]

nix that...

READ what I wrote.
Adultery, the act, the singular act of sleeping with the other person
ENDS the first marriage.

Afterwards, it is not adultery, the first marriage is dead, gone, nonexistent.
Therefore, it cannot be adultery.

Ok Im seeing it now, sorry for the confusion I may have caused, please forgive me.

[B A N E]

Ever read 1 John 1:9?

Since Paul says no adulterer will enter the kingdom of heaven, by your line of reasoning that means no person who has remarried can get into heaven. That's not what God intended. Any sin can be forgiven.

RevJeff,
And that is exactly why we forbid the pushing of remarriage=continual sin.
It creates a 2nd unforgiveable.

It creates a situation where if following the course prescribed by the
adherents of committing more sin to atone for prior sin.

God no where says sin more to fix the previous sin.

[boxer77]

[QUOTE=RevJeff;3509278]Ever read 1 John 1:9?

Since Paul says no adulterer will enter the kingdom of heaven, by your line of reasoning that means no person who has remarried can get into heaven. That's not what God intended. Any sin can be forgiven.[/Q

Good verse, IM gonna do more reaserch into this, mabey consult my John Mcaurther notes just to see how he descibes it.:D:

[boxer77]

RevJeff,
And that is exactly why we forbid the pushing of remarriage=continual sin.
It creates a 2nd unforgiveable.

It creates a situation where if following the course prescribed by the
adherents of committing more sin to atone for prior sin.

God no where says sin more to fix the previous sin.

I guess I saw it as forgiveable if you would repent and be single again.

Just like how fornicating is a sin, and if you repent of it you stop it, I didnt see adultery as a one time sin I guess.
Also King David came to mind, he stayed married to bathsheba didnt he?

[roadrunner570]

I think anytime we are dealing with issues like this with our brothers and sisters, its best to err on the side of grace, mercy and love. Nothing is gained by keeping our brothers and sister who have been divorced and remarried in bondage. Just my 2 cents.

[LivnForChrist]

I guess I saw it as forgiveable if you would repent and be single again.

Just like how fornicating is a sin, and if you repent of it you stop it, I didnt see adultery as a one time sin I guess.
Also King David came to mind, he stayed married to bathsheba didnt he?Yup. Dont feel bad boxer. Alot of people have struggled with this. My hubbie went to a pastor before we married with the ?. :):

[B A N E]

Ok Im seeing it now, sorry for the confusion I may have caused, please forgive me.
Of course.

For those interested,
Search "remarriage" "divorce" "adultery" here at RRMB and you will see
1000's of posts and pages of threads.

For those interested, read the study I linked to.
Whether or not you agree with the conclusion, perhaps it will help.

[LivnForChrist]

adultery breaks the covenent of marriage and it only takes 1 time to do it. So
remarriage is not a continual sin.

[B A N E]

I guess I saw it as forgiveable if you would repent and be single again.

Just like how fornicating is a sin, and if you repent of it you stop it, I didnt see adultery as a one time sin I guess.
Also King David came to mind, he stayed married to bathsheba didnt he?

Yes, David stayed married to Bathsheba.
David's wives:
Michal, Abigail, Micaah, Haggith, Eglah, Bathsheba, Ahinoam.

I suspect I'm forgetting some.

[boxer77]

Awsome! glad my eyes were opened up!:clap
I feel like a :tin :nod .

[Funmudder]

My remarriage is an adulterous life before the eyes of God?

No. Its not. Want to know why? :D:

Grace.

Lets talk about this adultery loophole shall we?
Jesus Himself said:
Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
I happen to think this verse applies to women as well as men.
Being that we are sinful fleshy creatures, and sexual temptation is everywhere in the world, it would be quite difficult to gaurd even your thoughts so thouroughly that it would never once happen over the decades of a marriage (yes even if its just that one teeny thought or one time your eyes lingered a wee bit too long at the others on the beach)

So lets see just what this word Adultery is applying to before we say its the ONLY way out of a marriage. Well, adultry covers quiet alot doesn't it? There is the physical aspect of an affair. There is adultery of sexual immorality in your mind. Then there is the adultery of putting anything or one in your spouses rightful place.
Like say your career. Putting your career ahead of your spouse. Making the worries of your job more important than the needs of your mate. Thats adultery too. Still it all goes back to the hardness of heart. Its not that the act of adultry gives us an out, thats being legalistic, its the intent behind the word adultery. Its that our hearts are so hard towards God and His word, His directions on how to have a fantastic marriage, that all of us at some point will commit some form of adultery. We are supposed to turn back to Him, find forgiveness, repent of those ways and try to be faithful to each other.

God gave us divorce because our hearts are hard to Him and His plan for marriage, not just in case our spouse steps out on us. Adultery is not a 'get out of marriage free' card.

God says He hates divorce (Malachi 2:16). He says that divorce is an act of violence. Why? "What God has put together let no man separate (tear apart)." Marriage is the first institution God established. Right from the beginning (Jesus Himself points this out) God made marriage to be a life long thing between one man and one woman. When that is broken it does violence to something God put together/established. So, regardless of the circumstances, God categorically hates divorce. Its a shame that the divorce rate within the church is just as high, if not higher, than the secular worlds.

But that in no way suspends His forgiveness from us should we find we can not work it out and get a divorce. Now its true, God hates divorce. But. Because He recognises that our hearts are still hard toward letting Him into our life fully and completely in all areas, He allows it. Does not mean He approves of it. See, God has something many people sorely lack, its called GRACE.

Getting remarried is a new covenant, a new putting together, and the Lord will bless a remarried couple just as generously as a once married couple. To imply anything else is trying to legalise the Lords grace, love and forgivness.

:hug

[boxer77]

I didnt realize adultery was a one time sin , and not a continual one.

Then I put the continual sin in the catagory of not truly repenting of sin.

Sorry for the mistake, I wish people would read all the posts....:heh

[Funmudder]

Sorry for the mistake, I wish people would read all the posts....:heh

Some people type so slow they don't realize things have progressed beyond needing further perspective :heh

[boxer77]

Some people type so slow they don't realize things have progressed beyond needing further perspective :heh

:laugh , I hear ya:nod

[SetApart]

here is an off the wall thought...

God speaks to the only acceptable reason for divorcing is adultery...i think the bible is pretty clear on that...

however..if you define adultery, it could mean a lot of different things perhaps. maybe a spouse was a workaholic and was gone all the time and focused on the job...and subsequently abandoned the family because of this issue. and let's say that the workaholic spouse never committed sexual adultery with another person even though they were out of the home and the priority was NOT the marriage, but in fact, the job.

taking a look at how God seems to define an adulterer---in the end times context anyway...has perhaps a more broad definition. the harlot riding the beast is considered an adulterer in the eyes of God because it represents the apostate church (correct me if i am wrong--trying to keep my facts in order)...

why? because the harlet appeared to love and honor God on the outside, but the actions and the heart of the harlot defected from faith and therefore commited adultery against God.

i wonder if adultery in a marriage has a more broad definition than just sexual adultery....especially when considering the definition we are familiar with in the Bible related to the false prophet or the apostate church.......

thoughts???

[fefeh]

I found that passage.

Deuteronomy 24:1-4 KJV: When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house. And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man’s wife. And if the latter husband hate her, and write her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand, and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife; Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that is abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

Divorce was final, not to be taken lightly. Once you divorced someone, you could never go back. This forced them to be cautious and think twice before divorce.

[Gary]

Awsome! glad my eyes were opened up!:clap
I feel like a :tin :nod .


Not at all :hug

I can't count the number of times I've felt like a bonehead...

[CaiperLane]

The Bible does not say divorce is a "sin." Paul was very careful in how he worded that. Paul said God hates divorce. In the OT and NT divorce was allowed and was never called a sin. But....this is NOT the way God intended it to be. It breaks down the family AND society which is why if divorce happens it's because EVERY avenue to save the union was sought and it still somehow was not enough. Most people DON'T exhaust every way possible to save the marriage which is why there are so many divorces.

My parents were divorced and my mother treated like dirt by people because of it and yet my father who was the cause of the breakup walked away and no one seemed to have a low opinion of him. He committed adultery, had a problem with alcohol and left my mother as she was beginning to become ill from a disease that would later take her life. But she bore the shame of the divorce even though God released her from the marriage. Our minister counseled her and advised her to let my father leave if he so chose to.

He also had said that scripturally divorce isn't a "sin" but has been labeled so because of many people's linking different verses together to make it so. Paul was clear. If it was considered a "sin" he would have said so. Paul never minced words. But because Paul said "God hates divorce" (not the people involved just the act of divorce, the braking of the union) it tells us that we cannot ever choose a decision to end a marriage without fighting to keep it. And to make sure God is at the center of it.

Your friend is NOT an adulteress. God forgives any trespass we may commit. But unfortunetly some people won't allow us to forget our mistakes. I Corinthians 13 says: "Love does not keep an account of wrongdoing but rejoices in the Truth." God chooses to forget any mistakes we made when we repent. God alone also knows your friend's heart. He knows the circumstances of the divorce and where her heart lies. No one else does. It's between her, God and her ex. If she has owned up to her part in the failure of the marriage God is just and forgives. And forgets. In His eyes she is pure and can remarry.

For as the heavens are high above the earth, so great is His mercy toward those who fear Him; As far as the east is from the west, so far has He removed our transgressions from us. - Psalm 103:11-12

But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.” - Jeremiah 31:32-34

Forgive “each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.” - Ephesians 4:32

Forgive and you will be forgiven..- Luke 7:37

'In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses'" - Ephesians 1:7.

[boxer77]

The Bible does not say divorce is a "sin." Paul was very careful in how he worded that. Paul said God hates divorce. In the OT and NT divorce was allowed and was never called a sin. But....this is NOT the way God intended it to be. It breaks down the family AND society which is why if divorce happens it's because EVERY avenue to save the union was sought and it still somehow was not enough. Most people DON'T exhaust every way possible to save the marriage which is why there are so many divorces.

My parents were divorced and my mother treated like dirt by people because of it and yet my father who was the cause of the breakup walked away and no one seemed to have a low opinion of him. He committed adultery, had a problem with alcohol and left my mother as she was beginning to become ill from a disease that would later take her life. But she bore the shame of the divorce even though God released her from the marriage. Our minister counseled her and advised her to let my father leave if he so chose to.

He also had said that scripturally divorce isn't a "sin" but has been labeled so because of many people's linking different verses together to make it so. Paul was clear. If it was considered a "sin" he would have said so. Paul never minced words. But because Paul said "God hates divorce" (not the people involved just the act of divorce, the braking of the union) it tells us that we cannot ever choose a decision to end a marriage without fighting to keep it. And to make sure God is at the center of it.

Your friend is NOT an adulteress. God forgives any trespass we may commit. But unfortunetly some people won't allow us to forget our mistakes. I Corinthians 13 says: "Love does not keep an account of wrongdoing but rejoices in the Truth." God chooses to forget any mistakes we made when we repent. God alone also knows your friend's heart. He knows the circumstances of the divorce and where her heart lies. No one else does. It's between her, God and her ex. If she has owned up to her part in the failure of the marriage God is just and forgives. And forgets. In His eyes she is pure and can remarry.

For as the heavens are high above the earth, so great is His mercy toward those who fear Him; As far as the east is from the west, so far has He removed our transgressions from us. - Psalm 103:11-12

But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.” - Jeremiah 31:32-34

Forgive “each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.” - Ephesians 4:32

Forgive and you will be forgiven..- Luke 7:37

'In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses'" - Ephesians 1:7.

As far as divorce not being a sin, God says He hates it, God is absolute, what God hates is sin, God dosent do gray, He either is Black or White, right or wrong.
1 Corinthians 7
10 To the married I give this command (not I, but the Lord): A wife must not separate from her husband.
11 But if she does, she must remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife.
Even reading this in context I still cant see the way "around" getting remarried.
What happens if they are remarried, what sin do they then commit, I guess it's adultery.

Mark 10
2 Some Pharisees came and tested him by asking, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife?"
3 "What did Moses command you?" he replied.
4 They said, "Moses permitted a man to write a certificate of divorce and send her away."
5 "It was because your hearts were hard that Moses wrote you this law," Jesus replied.
6 "But at the beginning of creation God `made them male and female.'
7 `For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife,
8 and the two will become one flesh.' So they are no longer two, but one.
9 Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate."
10 When they were in the house again, the disciples asked Jesus about this.
11 He answered, "Anyone who divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her.
12 And if she divorces her husband and marries another man, she commits adultery."


Matthew 19
3 Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?"
4 "Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator `made them male and female,'
5 and said, `For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'?
6 So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate."
7 "Why then," they asked, "did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?"
8 Jesus replied, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning.
9 I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery."
Also if it was a Godly marriage the bible says as long as the husband is alive remarriage is forbidden.
Pretty interesting, christians should think long and hard and pray before they go and remarry, according to what Paul taught.

[humbleone]

Then I put the continual sin in the catagory of not truly repenting of sin.



I thought repenting of a sin meant that you do not commit it any longer (or not habitually). Repent = a change of direction, going the other way.

:confused

But, I do not believe that one who marries and divorces, then remarries, is in "continual sin." I dont share that view. But that quote up above, Im not sure it's worded as clearly as it could be. It makes it sound like you can continue on and on in sin and have it not count as being unrepentant.

Peace,


humbleone

[fefeh]

As far as divorce not being a sin, God says He hates it, God is absolute, what God hates is sin, God dosent do gray, He either is Black or White, right or wrong.
1 Corinthians 7
10 To the married I give this command (not I, but the Lord): A wife must not separate from her husband.
11 But if she does, she must remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife.
Even reading this in context I still cant see the way "around" getting remarried.
What happens if they are remarried, what sin do they then commit, I guess it's adultery.


Even if remarriage is a sin, staying in that marriage is not adultery, that is marriage. To divorce again would be a sin.


Pretty interesting, christians should think long and hard and pray before they go and remarry, according to what Paul taught.

and before they marry in the first place! :nod

[boxer77]

Even if remarriage is a sin, staying in that marriage is not adultery, that is marriage. To divorce again would be a sin.



and before they marry in the first place! :nod

Agreed.

[boxer77]

Im still trying to figure out which sins are habitual and which ones only count as one time.
I guess in the sin of divorce is only habitual if you keep on getting married and then divorced over and over again.

[CaiperLane]

Let’s not forget that God allowed divorce in the Old Testament because of people’s “hard hearts.” Does this mean that Jesus was describing the ideal – what we should all aspire to – but the Old Testament was describing God’s understanding of practical reality in a fallen world?

"The Lord is merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and plenteous in mercy . . . For He knoweth our frame; He remembereth that we are dust" (Psalm 103:8, 14). "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins" (I John 1:9). This promise is specifically for Christians, and includes even the sin of adultery, if there is genuine repentance. The Lord made this very clear in His dealing with the woman who "was taken in adultery, in the very act" (John 8:4). He reminded her accusers that they also were sinners and had no warrant to punish her. Then He told the woman: "Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more" (John 8:11).

He in no way condoned her sin, but He did forgive her sin, when she gave evidence of godly sorrow and determination not to sin again in this way. Under such conditions, His followers would do well to follow His example. At least in this particular context, He put no further conditions on her freedom, either to return to her husband if he would have her, or to marry another if she were already divorced.

By extension, these principles could be applied to other situations that the Scriptures do not cover explicitly. As noted above, God is able and willing to forgive all sins, including even the sin of getting a divorce for trivial reasons. He has called us to peace, not legal bondage, and He can make a good marriage and a happy home no matter what the previous history of the people involved may have been, provided that true repentance, proper restitution, and genuine saving faith and sincere desire to serve the Lord now exist in their lives.

It's all about healing and forgiveness. Jesus was speaking of unrepentive sinners who continued to live in their bad choices and sin.

God's Law on Divorce and Remarriage
A conditional contract (covenant) is one that specifies conditions that both parties must fulfill; and if one party breaks the contract, the wronged party may sue at law for damages or annulment of the contract. By definition marriage contracts are conditional contracts. It was always so in ancient times, and in this respect the Code of Hammurabi is in total agreement with the law of God.

Divorce that is, a complete break in the marriage contract is lawful, because virtually all marriage contracts involve vows made by two parties. In God's marriage to Israel at Mt. Sinai, Israel (the bride) agreed to submit to His authority and obey His laws (Ex. 19:3-8). God, on the other hand, agreed to give them the Kingdom and the blessings of the Birthright. These included honor, protection, sustenance, and children (Gen. 12:1-3).

Israel violated this contract, being incapable of full obedience, and refused to repent; and thus, her Husband divorced her and sent her out of His house. Jeremiah 3:8 says,

8 And I saw that for all the adulteries of faithless Israel, I had sent her away and given her a writ of divorce, yet her treacherous sister Judah did not fear; but she went and was a harlot also.

Note that God not only sent her away, but only did so after giving her a written bill of divorce. This was in accordance with the law in Deut. 24 that we will quote shortly. Hosea 2:2 also shows that God’s divorce meant Israel was no longer God’s wife, saying to her,

2 Contend with your mother , contend, for she is not my wife, and I am not her husband;

Because God Himself is a divorcee, we can safely say that divorce itself is not necessarily a sin. It can be a sin, of course, if the one demanding a divorce does so with evil motives that are not in the will of God. But the fact that God divorced Israel shows that lawful divorce is the result of sin, or violation of the contract. It is the final solution to the problem when all else fails, and when reconciliation is impossible. God's law on divorce and remarriage is given in Deut. 24:1-4 ~

"[I]When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house. And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man's wife. And if the latter husband hate her, and write her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand, and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife; Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that is abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance."

Others say it means divorce is only lawful if the husband discovers that his wife had had illicit sexual relations with someone else before they were married. However, such a situation also calls for the death penalty, and this is elaborated upon in detail in Deut. 22:13-21.

Thus, the grounds for divorce in the 24th chapter must be something else. Since the grounds are not specified, it would appear that the common law needed no modifying here. Thus, it is helpful to look at the Code of Hammurabi for a list of the grounds for divorce.

The Code specifies cruelty, slander, waste of family assets, and running up needless debts as being grounds for a man to divorce his wife. This is in addition to any other violation that may have been written into the contract.

The wife, too, could divorce her husband for those same offenses, but in addition to them, she could divorce him for lack of support (i.e., food, clothing, and conjugal relations; compare with Exodus 21:10,11.)

We may conclude, then, that these basic grounds for divorce were similar in both law codes, as God's law passes over the question without modification. The primary difference between the ancient laws and Moses is that God takes an interest in the matters of the heart. Hence, even if the outward grounds for divorce appear to exist, there may well be hidden motives and sinful attitudes are against the spirit of the divine law. Such things, in the eyes of God, would make that divorce unlawful.

In Mark 10:2-9 the Pharisees asked Jesus if it were lawful to put away one's wife. Jesus asked them in turn what Moses had said. They answered that Moses had commanded them to write a bill of divorcement and to put her away. Jesus then replied, "For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept." He went on to explain that divorce did not follow the perfect order of creation that was set up at the beginning. In other words, divorce is not a good thing, but because men's hearts are hard, it is necessary that provision be made for handling broken marriage contracts. For the same reason, God instituted the death penalty for first-degree murder. From the beginning it was not so, for God created us to live together in harmony. But for the hardness of men's hearts, it became a very necessary judgment to curb such violent crime.

The fact is, ALL LAWS exist only because of the hard-ness of men's hearts. If all men were perfect, there would be no need for laws, for the laws would be written in our hearts. We would be totally incorruptible. Paul wrote in 1 Timothy 1:9, "the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient." Thus, so long as there are unrighteous men on the earth, the law must remain in effect, in order that we may have some restraint on men's lusts and wickedness. We conclude, then, that in order to govern men justly in the present state of affairs, God's laws on divorce are absolutely necessary prior to the time that men come fully under the New Covenant and are no longer lawless. Divorce, therefore, should not be necessary among Christians. However, Christians, too, are often lawless and disobedient to the perfect will of God. For this reason divorce provisions are necessary even for Christians.

When a marriage contract has been broken, and especially if one or both parties refuse to repent and restore the lawful order, divorce may well be the only solution. God does not expect the innocent party to honor the contract when the guilty party refuses to do so. The contract is always conditional. Thus, Jesus' statement, "For the hardness of your heart," should not be construed to mean that divorce itself is a sin. Remember that God Himself is a divorcee, according to Jer. 3:8, yet He did not sin in divorcing Israel.

Nor must we believe that the people twisted God's arm and forced Him to allow divorce. If divorce were a sin, and God allowed it, then God was legalizing sin. This would be a serious accusation for mortals to make, especially in view of the testimony of David in Psalm 19:7 that "The law of the Lord is PERFECT, converting the soul."

Matthew 5:31, 32 is by far the most important passage used by most people to prove that remarriage after divorce is adultery. It reads:

31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement; 32 But I say unto you, that whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery; and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

As interpreted by the King James translation, it would appear that Jesus positively condemned divorce and remarriage, thus showing God's law to be inferior to divine moral standards. If divorce indeed causes one to commit adultery, then divorce itself would be a sin, according to God's law of liability. Remarriage, too, would constitute adultery. However, as we will show, neither is a sin.

First of all, this passage is a part of His "Sermon on the Mount," which is for the most part a commentary on Bible law. In verses 17-19 He disclaimed the idea that He was trying to destroy or undermine the law. Further, He positively condemned those who would break the shortest commandment and teach others to do so. From this alone it should be clear that Jesus did not abolish God's laws on divorce and remarriage.

Then in verse 20 Jesus said that our righteousness must EXCEED that of the Scribes and Pharisees. With that in mind, He began to give us examples of Bible law to show how they fell short of the law's righteous standard. They did not keep the true spirit of the law and misinterpreted it in many ways.

1.Thou shalt not kill (vs. 21-26)

2.Thou shalt not commit adultery (vs. 27-32)

3.Thou shalt not bear false witness (vs. 33-37)

4.An eye for an eye (vs. 38-42)

5.Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself (vs. 43-48)

In each case the law in question is introduced with the following format: "It has been said (interpreted in the synagogue). . . but I say unto you. . ." This is not to be construed to mean that Jesus is putting away all of these divine laws, or that He is replacing each of them with something different or better. It is not the law of God He is discrediting; it is the Pharisaical interpretation of the law and a legalistic spirit that He is disagreeing with. In other words, Jesus did NOT put away the law on murder when He said, "Thou shalt not kill. . . but I say unto you. . . ." Nor did He make it lawful to commit adultery, so long as you don't look upon another woman with lust while you do it.

In a nutshell, then, the purpose of the "Sermon on the Mount" was to improve upon the law's interpretation and application. The true spirit of the law had been lost through the traditions of the elders.

With that context in mind, and knowing that Jesus did not destroy the law, let us look at Matthew 5:31, 32 in greater detail. These two verses are a part of His comment on "Thou shalt not commit adultery," so the final thrust of His comment is to define adultery in relation to the laws of divorce and remarriage. Verse 31 simply refers to Deut. 24:1, where God demanded that men give their wives a WRITTEN bill of divorcement before they could lawfully put away their wives. Verse 2, of course, allowed divorced wives to remarry after a lawful divorce. So let us take another look at Matthew 5:31, 32, inserting a few key words in the original Greek, so that we get a proper translation of the passage.

Verse 31: It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away (apoluo) his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement (apostasion). 32 But I say unto you, that whosoever shall put away (apoluo) his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery; and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced (apoluo, lit. "put away") committeth adultery.

To paraphrase this: The law says that she commits adultery if she remarries without a written bill of divorcement. BUT I SAY UNTO YOU that whoever puts her away (without divorce papers; that is, unlawfully) causes her to commit adultery (if she remarries under such conditions). Thus, he who simply put her out of his house without divorcing her properly is JUST AS LIABLE AS SHE IS. And whosoever marries her that has been put away (without divorce papers) also commits adultery, because he is marrying another man's wife.

Jesus is here condemning men who put away their wives Babylonian style (verbally), instead of putting them away in the manner prescribed by God's law. Under the laws of liability, this would make him guilty of adultery if she were to remarry. So we see that the whole point of this commentary is to bring out a point of law that had not been covered by the Pharisees in their interpretations.

But what of the phrase, "saving for the cause of fornication?" What does this mean? Most people assume it means that if a wife commits adultery, then it is lawful to divorce her. However, it does NOT say, "except for the cause of ADULTERY." Further, the penalty for adultery was death-not divorce. So what is meant by "fornication?" Why is it alright to put away one's spouse without divorce papers in a case of fornication?

The most common type of fornication is prostitution (Ex. 22:16). This is where a man has sexual relations with an unmarried woman. The solution is either to get married (Ex. 22:16, 17) or separate (repent and stop doing it). However, the word also covers other forms of unlawful sexual relations. In Hebrews 12:16 Esau is called a fornicator; yet there is no record in Scripture of his buying the services of a prostitute. But Genesis 26:34 does say that he married Hittite wives. From the account in Scripture, this obviously went against God's command not to take a wife from among the Canaanites. Thus, it may be classified as an unlawful marriage.

We find the term "fornication" used again in 1 Cor. 5:1. 1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. Thus we see that Paul uses the term "fornication" to describe another unlawful marriage or sexual relationship that had been forbidden in Leviticus 18:7, 8, namely, incest.

In Jude 7 we read of the people of Sodom and Gomorrha who had given themselves over to "fornication," going after "strange flesh." This, too, is obviously a sexual sin, and yet the only thing we have on record of their sexual tendencies is homosexuality, or "sodomy" (Gen. 19:4-8). Each of these examples have one thing in common: they are unlawful sexual relationships, and therefore, there is no LAWFUL marriage contract to bind the two parties together. In other words God does not recognize the "marriage" in the first place. It is void from the start.

Thus, when Jesus says it is alright to "put away" (separate without divorce papers) one's spouse in the case of fornication, the reason is quite obvious. There was no lawfully-binding marriage contract in the first place, so how can one appeal to the law of God to have it voided? God requires no such divorce papers. However, if the couple had obtained a marriage license from a humanist government such as those of this world order, then they would have to petition it for a divorce as well, because humanist governments recognize many marriage relationships that God's law does not. God does not recognize relationships which are homosexual, incestual, or otherwise forbidden as in the case of Esau, even if the parties sign a marriage contract. Another case where divorce papers are unnecessary is in the case of prostitution. Since prostitutes do not enter marriage contracts with a client, the solution is separation, not divorce.

We have seen, then, that not only did the Code of Hammurabi (the ancient law before Moses) permit divorce and remarriage, but so did God's law. The main difference was the legal procedure of obtaining a proper divorce, in order to protect the women involved. We have also seen how Jesus added teeth to God's law by proclaiming that he who puts away his wife without a written bill of divorce causes her to commit adultery, and thus he is fully liable for her sin before God. Finally, we have seen how the Apostle Paul also understood that a remarriage after divorce is not sin. Common belief on this subject has put many people into bondage, either by forcing divorced people to remain single when they are unsuited to such a life, or else by placing on their shoulders a load of guilt for remarrying.

Understanding the Biblical historical facts behind the original OT Hebrew and NT Greek shows us that the divorce/remarriage subject is not so cut and dry.

[MNGirl]

So are sexual relations with an ex-husband with reconciliation in mind a sin?

[B A N E]

So are sexual relations with an ex-husband with reconciliation in mind a sin?

Yes.
Neither of you is married to the other.

[rdy2go2]

I have been reading this thread for two days now and it has put me into a tail spin. I am getting ready to remarry and didn't sleep at all last night after reading all these interpretations! All I did was read m:cry y bible last night and try to research everything I have read.

Yipes!

[HeartlandGal]

I have been reading this thread for two days now and it has put me into a tail spin. I am getting ready to remarry and didn't sleep at all last night after reading all these interpretations! All I did was read m:cry y bible last night and try to research everything I have read.

Yipes!

I am happily married (first and only husband) and this has put me in a tail spin also..

So if a divorced person is a christian, biblically it seems to say they are not to remarry.

So if a christian person knows this and does remarry, can they simply say "sorry" even though they knew they were going against what is taught? Or is this depending on the reason they were divorced?

I would never be happy if my child, knew they were doing something wrong but in their minds said "Lets do it anyway, then I will apologize and make things better"... To me that would be worse then them doing something wrong if they didn't know it was wrong.

Someone help me out here.

[boxer77]

Im reading it as, it depends on what the grounds of the divorce are.
I also Interpret if the grounds for divorce are in opposition to what the bible says , it says not to remarry.
If Im wrong or reading out of context a admin will be right here helping us understand things a bit better I hope.
Thats the other thing, knowing it is a sin and doing it anyways, I have sinned this way( not divorce) but known and did it anyways., and it dosent lead anywere good.
Its not an unforgiveable sin of course, But I wouldnt be able to get married knowing God made mention that if the first was terminated wrongly the first time, then better to not marry again. Goign into it with the attitude of Oh well God will forgive me, is not a good way to get a marrige started off, if your a christian that is.
Again if Im wrong someone chime in....:nod

[SetApart]

the way i look at it i guess after reading all this, praying, and my own basic understanding of sin...including the sin associated/implied/or directly related the subject of divorce, is that it ranks right up there with any other violation of God's law---we as human beings generally understand what these laws are (especially if we are trying to learn and understand them) and we still find ourselves far from perfect....no matter the subject...adultery, idolatry, lying, gossip, unforgiveness...onandonandon....

God forgives us of our sins if we repent....and repent in its most complete definition--not just ask for forgiveness just so we can clear our conscience and think we have a "clean slate" only to repeat what we know is wrong and do it all over again.

i cannot wrap my head around the fact that God will always consider someone a sinner if they have been divorced and been remarried--even if adultery was never in the equation---after they have truly repented for whatever sins were committed.

why would God hold sins of divorce and marriage in a different place in the heirarchy of sins...or have different rules related to their forgivability (if that is a word)...

He, i believe, examines the heart when a person repents and then makes the determination as to whether the sin is forgiven or not.....just my 27 cents...

[ZeroHour]

I think anytime we are dealing with issues like this with our brothers and sisters, its best to err on the side of grace, mercy and love. Nothing is gained by keeping our brothers and sister who have been divorced and remarried in bondage. Just my 2 cents.

I agree. And I'm glad they will stand before the Lord and not some of their fellow Christians.

[boxer77]

Well when we all get to heaven we will see things as Jesus so standing infront of other christians wont be a bad thing there either.;):

[bufferb34]

I believe what Jesus has to say about it.


Matthew 5:32

But I say that a man who divorces his wife, unless she has been unfaithful, causes her to commit adultery. And anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

[OneDayNearer]

I believe what Jesus has to say about it.


Matthew 5:32

But I say that a man who divorces his wife, unless she has been unfaithful, causes her to commit adultery. And anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

Me too.

[CaiperLane]

Me too.


Remember you have to take it within it's context and historical background....(see my above loooong post.) :B:

[Snowowll]

:ranger Just joining this thread, but having read the other comments, I find the discussion interesting. Seems like the Word of God is either the Word of God, or it isn't. If it is, then how can we select what and how to believe? Picking and choosing what to believe appears to rewrite Scripture in order to support what we want to believe so we can justify how we want to behave. Matthew 5:32 seems quite straightforward and the Old Testament does say God hates divorce. Sometimes, it seems to me anyway, that we think God is great until He goes all negative on us with those absolutes that aren't really comfortable. Still, there are reasons for those boundries. There are lots of causualties from divorce.

[boxer77]

Some forget the part were it says in most vows "till death do us part", or we can void that if we have irreconcilable difrrences.:rolleyes
I guess if we want to go the law "rout" those who get divorced are hard hearted?:noidea
Why are people hardhearted? cause of unrepentent sin?

[Ponderin]

Or we can void that if we have irreconcilable difrrences. http://rr-bb.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

We can.

Why are people hardhearted? cause of unrepentent sin?

Unforgiveness, maybe?




I believe God hates divorce. I hate it as well.

none the less . . .


C S Lewis put it well and understands the problems of pain.

"Prostitutes [Or I believe we could insert Adulterers] are in no danger of finding their present life so satisfactory that they cannot turn to God: the proud, the avaricious, the self-righteous, are in that danger."

--The Problem of Pain (200)

[boxer77]

I was reading first Corinthians 13 last night, and what love is all about.
People do throw away marriages all to quickly, my parents almost seperated, and it killed me since I was living with them, it was like someone had died, I weeped for days.
God intervened and they are still married, just had their 35 wedding aniversary.
Many divorces would not happen if people would be less selfish, and just read Gods word and obey His statutes.

[OneDayNearer]

And forgive. If people were willing to forgive the wrongs committed against them, families would stay together and children would have both parents in the home. We are to forgive 70 times 7. We are to forgive if we want to be forgiven.

Remember Jesus said whoever looks at a woman to lust after her has committed adultery with her already in his heart. If adultery is grounds for divorce, just about every single marriage could be ended on this verse alone. I think He said this to show us that while we might appear squeaky clean on the outside to others and even believe it ourselves, we are not really any different than the adulterers we choose to divorce rather than forgive.

We can forgive even the worst offenses against us if we have a willing heart. Yes, even adultery can be forgiven. It is not the unpardonable sin. Many couples have gotten through infidelity and come out stronger. Sometimes the forgiveness won't come naturally when it comes to betrayal, but if we ask God to put that forgiveness in our hearts, He will do it. He wants us to have a heart to forgive. That's what loving others is all about. We extend mercy to others because He has extended His mercy to us.

[Ponderin]

Boxer,

I expect they felt like they were the living dead as well. :(


Paul referred to himself as "chief" among sinners (1Tim 1:15) He was a way better Christian than I will ever be.

Today our visiting pastor told a neat story today about three planes that did not make it.

Here is my rendition . . . :lol

Three man made planes.

One group of "good people" got just off the run way and crashed. The next loaded, and passed over that "1st" group thinkin "What a relief we are not like them" :^). As they passed over the ocean the main engines failed and they plummeted to their death.
The third group were filled with relief as they thought "WHEW! Thank you God WE are not like those otha' two (2) groups" :^). They boarded their own plane of self righteousness, almost made it home but just before landing the wheels locked it crashed and exploded into flames.

There is a Forth Plane

The Fourth Plane was full of a bunch of rag tag losers who put their trust in the finished work of Christ, not a plane that man made. They all were carried Home. Not because of what they had done, but because of what He has done.

:)

[Snowowll]

:ranger I am divorced, but it was not a step taken in haste. For years, I tried to do what I could to salvage the marriage because my parents were divorced, but it does take two working things out, and there was only one of us working at it - and for other reasons, the divorce happened. The key, as Boxer77 and Ponderin pointed out, is that you have to work at marriage, and sometimes there is success, and sometimes, not. Part of healing from divorce is forgiveness. When God's presence in the decision is absent, there can be generations negatively affected.

I've not remarried because of God's Word against it, but many people see nothing wrong with remarrying. I go to the Word. And I don't always like the answer. But there it is.

[HeIsEnough]

Here is my rendition . . .


:):

[OneDayNearer]

:ranger I am divorced, but it was not a step taken in haste. For years, I tried to do what I could to salvage the marriage because my parents were divorced, but it does take two working things out, and there was only one of us working at it - and for other reasons, the divorce happened. The key, as Boxer77 and Ponderin pointed out, is that you have to work at marriage, and sometimes there is success, and sometimes, not. Part of healing from divorce is forgiveness. When God's presence in the decision is absent, there can be generations negatively affected.

I've not remarried because of God's Word against it, but many people see nothing wrong with remarrying. I go to the Word. And I don't always like the answer. But there it is.

I am divorced also. It was against my will but you can't force someone to remain married to you.

Like you, I went to the Word to see what it said about remarrying. It seemed crystal clear to me that I could not remarry. I definitely don't like the answer I found because it gets terribly lonely but God's word is God's word.

[boxer77]

Boxer,

I expect they felt like they were the living dead as well. :(


Paul referred to himself as "chief" among sinners (1Tim 1:15) He was a way better Christian than I will ever be.

Today our visiting pastor told a neat story today about three planes that did not make it.

Here is my rendition . . . :lol

Three man made planes.

One group of "good people" got just off the run way and crashed. The next loaded, and passed over that "1st" group thinkin "What a relief we are not like them" :^). As they passed over the ocean the main engines failed and they plummeted to their death.
The third group were filled with relief as they thought "WHEW! Thank you God WE are not like those otha' two (2) groups" :^). They boarded their own plane of self righteousness, almost made it home but just before landing the wheels locked it crashed and exploded into flames.

There is a Forth Plane

The Fourth Plane was full of a bunch of rag tag losers who put their trust in the finished work of Christ, not a plane that man made. They all were carried Home. Not because of what they had done, but because of what He has done.

:)

Can you explain this in a non parable form?
I kinda understand but not to sure where you were trying to go with this....
Thanks!

[bufferb34]

I am 39 and still remember when churches would not remarry a divorced person. Just because few churches don't abide by that anymore to please the people and keep them coming does not mean it is now ok. Sadly it is a hard thing to hear and a hard thing to live with.

[HeIsEnough]

Can you explain this in a non parable form?
I kinda understand but not to sure where you were trying to go with this....
Thanks!

It reminded me of this, friend.


Luke 18

The Parable of the Pharisee and the Tax Collector
9To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everybody else, Jesus told this parable: 10"Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11The Pharisee stood up and prayed about[a] himself: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. 12I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.'

13"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'

14"I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."

[dds girl]

1 Corinthians, Chapter7
12To the rest I say this (I, not the Lord): If any brother has a wife who is not a believer and she is willing to live with him, he must not divorce her. 13And if a woman has a husband who is not a believer and he is willing to live with her, she must not divorce him. 14For the unbelieving husband has been sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife has been sanctified through her believing husband. Otherwise your children would be unclean, but as it is, they are holy.

15But if the unbeliever leaves, let him do so. A believing man or woman is not bound in such circumstances; God has called us to live in peace.

Your post doesn't say whether she was a believer at the time of the divorce, if it says so later and I missed it I'm sorry. But if she was not a believer at the time from this passage it seems not to be an issue.

[Ponderin]

It reminded me of this, friend.

Yes James, that was what "my rendition" reminded me of. Seemed clear enough to me. " 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector."


There was no forth plane in our visiting pastors story.

He was teaching "you must be born again".


I added the forth plane.


Boxer,

Where am I going?

I'm not sure what the purpose of all the threads are here . . . But I do get the idea here, often, there are those who look down on others because we missed the mark of sinless perfection.

I'm not a great, revered and celebrated writer, here, nor there . . . lol

Maybe, I missed a point. :D:

The Fourth Plane was full of a bunch of rag tag losers who put their trust in the finished work of Christ, not a plane that man made. They all were carried Home. Not because of what they had done, or failed to do, perfectly this side of eternity, but because of what He has done.

Is that better? :):

[steph1962]

I was married to my ex-husband for 19 years and he had several episodes of adultery all through our marriage. I always forgave him and we have three children. He divorced me last year. I asked the court to not grant the divorce and refer us to counseling instead. I also asked him privately not to go through with this divorce, but for us to give counseling a try. He refused. I did everything I could. I prayed and had friends pray. I forgave him. I asked for reconciliation. We have been divorced for a year and a half. I haven't dated because I haven't been interested and (as a single mom) there isn't a lot of time. He is getting ready to be remarried. So what some of you are saying is that it would be a sin for me to re-marry??? Even after I did everything humanly possible to prevent a divorce from happening...???

Stephanie C.

[Ponderin]

I was married to my ex-husband for 19 years and he had several episodes of adultery all through our marriage. I always forgave him and we have three children. He divorced me last year. I asked the court to not grant the divorce and refer us to counseling instead. I also asked him privately not to go through with this divorce, but for us to give counseling a try. He refused. I did everything I could. I prayed and had friends pray. I forgave him. I asked for reconciliation. We have been divorced for a year and a half. I haven't dated because I haven't been interested and (as a single mom) there isn't a lot of time. He is getting ready to be remarried. So what some of you are saying is that it would be a sin for me to re-marry??? Even after I did everything humanly possible to prevent a divorce from happening...???

Stephanie C.

I think, if I understand it right after reading the whole thread . . . It was set up as "my friend" is in agony over remarrying. Though it was never stated that she did in fact divorced under the "perfect legal law" of God.

Then Boxer comes in and says remarriage is continuing in sin,. Then B AN E pops in and says he ain't playing that, for real.

So Boxer decides to understand now and boxer does not get banned. Then lots more opining occurred. . . .

Then I got the idea that only people who divorced "the right" way are the "good" people and the rest of us losers should take on projected guilt from the OP and hopelessness to boot because there is no hope for us . . .

But maybe, I have read one to many stock bulletin boards where they set them up and knock them down. You know kinda like a bowling alley?


Any how, that is my 2 cents what I have taken from this and many other threads here. I could be wrong? never the less . . .


Grace Abounding
March 22nd, 1863
by
C. H. SPURGEON
(1834-1892)
"I will love them freely."—Hosea 14:4.


"Would not this be a great slur cast upon the grace of God?

Suppose I could find out a sinner so vile that Jesus Christ could not reach him; why then the devils in hell would take him through their streets as a trophy; they would say, "This man was more than a match for God; his sin was too great for God's grace." What says the Apostle? "Where sin abounded"—that is you, poor sinner;—"where sin abounded"—what sins you plunged into last night, and on other black occasions,—"where sin abounded"—what? Condemnation? Hopeless despair? No, "Where sin abounded grace did much more abound." I think I see the conflict in the great arena of the universe. Man piles a mountain of sin, but God will match it, and he upheaves a loftier mountain of grace; man heaps up a still huger hill of sin, but the Lord overtops it with ten times more grace; and so the contest continues till at last the mighty God plucks up the mountains by the roots and buries man's sin beneath them as a fly might be buried beneath an Alp. Abundant sin is no barrier to the superabundant grace of God."

[HeIsEnough]

I was married to my ex-husband for 19 years and he had several episodes of adultery all through our marriage. I always forgave him and we have three children. He divorced me last year. I asked the court to not grant the divorce and refer us to counseling instead. I also asked him privately not to go through with this divorce, but for us to give counseling a try. He refused. I did everything I could. I prayed and had friends pray. I forgave him. I asked for reconciliation. We have been divorced for a year and a half. I haven't dated because I haven't been interested and (as a single mom) there isn't a lot of time. He is getting ready to be remarried. So what some of you are saying is that it would be a sin for me to re-marry??? Even after I did everything humanly possible to prevent a divorce from happening...???

Stephanie C.

Nancy is a straight shooter, Stephanie. :thumb

It sounds to me like your heart is innocent in the matter, even considering the letter of the law from the lawgiver Himself, Jesus Christ:


Matthew 5

27"You have heard that it was said, 'Do not commit adultery.'[e] 28But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.

But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery.

You will also notice this was said directly to a bunch of men who found joy in taking the 'heart' of what God wants and turning it into a lawyerly affair. Jesus, being a very smart person :):, knew to trap them in their own devices and their own ways of circumventing Gods desires by their little loopholes. Men will go to great lengths to justify themselves in other mens eyes, yet God is not fooled. Though I am nobody, I don't see any problem with what you just layed out Stephanie. Your ex on the other hand, will need to deal with his own ways of keeping true to his new wife....may God show him the right way.

[steph1962]

Thanks, guys. I know in my heart that I tried every single thing I could do legally and personally to reconcile with my ex-husband. I was like most folks - I took my vows seriously and intended to marry this person forever.

I have not met anyone who has ever gone through a divorce that hasn't (immediately or eventually) grieved over it in some way. Whether they were the ones that wanted the divorce or not. Even my ex - I know he has experienced some grief because he no longer lives with his children. I agree with the person who said that we should always err on the side of showing love, grace, and mercy. There are a lot of folks that are hurting all around us.

Stephanie C.

[boxer77]

Yes James, that was what "my rendition" reminded me of. Seemed clear enough to me. " 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector."


There was no forth plane in our visiting pastors story.

He was teaching "you must be born again".


I added the forth plane.


Boxer,

Where am I going?

I'm not sure what the purpose of all the threads are here . . . But I do get the idea here, often, there are those who look down on others because we missed the mark of sinless perfection.

I'm not a great, revered and celebrated writer, here, nor there . . . lol

Maybe, I missed a point. :D:

The Fourth Plane was full of a bunch of rag tag losers who put their trust in the finished work of Christ, not a plane that man made. They all were carried Home. Not because of what they had done, or failed to do, perfectly this side of eternity, but because of what He has done.

Is that better? :):
Sorry if I came of self rightous, I put up some scripture and how I interpreted it, if others were convicted, as I was then so be it, it wasent ment to harm anyone, but sometimes Gods word divides right down to the joint and marrow.
Im a sinner just like anyone else.

[CaiperLane]

:ranger I am divorced, but it was not a step taken in haste. For years, I tried to do what I could to salvage the marriage because my parents were divorced, but it does take two working things out, and there was only one of us working at it - and for other reasons, the divorce happened. The key, as Boxer77 and Ponderin pointed out, is that you have to work at marriage, and sometimes there is success, and sometimes, not. Part of healing from divorce is forgiveness. When God's presence in the decision is absent, there can be generations negatively affected.

I've not remarried because of God's Word against it, but many people see nothing wrong with remarrying. I go to the Word. And I don't always like the answer. But there it is.

You CAN remarry.

God doesn't keep an account of wrongdoings if you are a Believer. Ask God for forgiveness for any part you may have played in the divorce.

God forgives AND forgets. (Just read I Corinthians 13) Then if you ever do remarry (and it should be to a fellow Believer) He will bless your marriage.

The Bible is the Word of God. But we have to take it within the context that it was meant to be taken in. (see my really long post a few posts back)

[Ponderin]

Sorry if I came of self rightous, I put up some scripture and how I interpreted it, if others were convicted, as I was then so be it, it wasent ment to harm anyone, but sometimes Gods word divides right down to the joint and marrow.
Im a sinner jsut like anyoen else.



No need to apologize to me. I was not seeking an apology and am not convicted by your interpretation. And on top of all that, I am not The Word.

[bufferb34]

deleted

[boxer77]

No need to apologize to me. I was not seeking an apology and am not convicted by your interpretation. And on top of all that, I am not The Word.

Amen, I kinda knew you were not the Word.:D:
My reason for joining this thred was to learn and to share what I thought, it wasent a "witch hunt" for sinners and to condem them.
I did learn a little from others, its funny how people jump all over someone when they disagree.
But any way, a very interesting thred none the less.
God Bless

[Ponderin]

Amen, I kinda knew you were not the Word.:D:
My reason for joining this thred was to learn and to share what I thought, it wasent a "witch hunt" for sinners and to condem them.
I did learn a little from others, its funny how people jump all over someone when they disagree.
But any way, a very interesting thred none the less.
God Bless

Riviting subject, I agree. However, not funny.

Jumping? Who is jumping?


My point was even those who are looked down on are no match for God. It is not the well who need a doctor. Fact is I've not meet anyone well enough to live without the Grace of God.

"Would not this be a great slur cast upon the grace of God?

Suppose I could find out a sinner so vile that Jesus Christ could not reach him; why then the devils in hell would take him through their streets as a trophy; they would say, "This man was more than a match for God; his sin was too great for God's grace." What says the Apostle? "Where sin abounded"—that is you, poor sinner;—"where sin abounded"—what sins you plunged into last night, and on other black occasions,—"where sin abounded"—what? Condemnation? Hopeless despair? No, "Where sin abounded grace did much more abound." I think I see the conflict in the great arena of the universe. Man piles a mountain of sin, but God will match it, and he upheaves a loftier mountain of grace; man heaps up a still huger hill of sin, but the Lord overtops it with ten times more grace; and so the contest continues till at last the mighty God plucks up the mountains by the roots and buries man's sin beneath them as a fly might be buried beneath an Alp. Abundant sin is no barrier to the superabundant grace of God."

[boxer77]

Who said anything was funny?
We all need Gods Grace without it we are all doomed, this thred is about divorce
and what we think Gods word says about it.
I dont condem anyone that has had a divorce, I pray for them that they will find peace, and a awsome relationship with another person if they feel it is what God wants them to do.

[Ponderin]

Who said anything was funny?


its funny how people jump all over someone when they disagree.

[Ladybug]

Ponderin, he meant 'funny' odd, not 'funny' haha.

[Ponderin]

Ponderin, he meant 'funny' odd, not 'funny' haha.

I musta missed the memo. However, it is not odd seeings how I saw noone jumping.

:noidea

[rdy2go2]

Sorry I couldn't jump in sooner. Internet was down all weekend.

I was beaten and abused. I found out after we were married that he never got rid of his girlfriends. He would go to much trouble to "keep me out of the way" like sending me on a trip to Europe so he could take "her" on a cruise. Each and every time I found out about his affairs I would confront him which would result in him hitting me and spitting on me. I asked him to go to a counselor, which he did. He professed to love me and didn't want me to leave but I honestly felt my life was in danger. The counselor told me the chances of him changing were slim to none. After many beatings and his continued unfaithfulness, I left.

Now I have met a great christian man who has helped me heal both physically and spritually. I cannot believe we are not supposed to be together. I firmly believe (and God knows my heart) that while the divorce is clearly a sin, but foregiveable, there is also another sin. We clearly have a responsibility to know who we are getting married to. I did not stop to look at all the signs that were there. I should have never married the man in the first place. For that mistake I am more sorry than you will ever know. If more people would wait, and pay attention, and not enter into marriage so lightly, I think there would be less pain and suffering all around.

I wish so badly that I had the marrital history that some of you have. One spouse, memories, etc. That is pricelesss! You are so blessed to have that gift.

[boxer77]

[QUOTE=Ponderin;3517048]I musta missed the memo. However, it is not odd seeings how I saw noone jumping.

:noidea[/QUOTE
The jumping I was refering to, or the way I took it would be the accusation of people on the thred being self-rightous.
Peoples circumstances are all diffrent, I understand, yet even in diffrent circumstances Gods word stays the same, It dosent change when we get into problems, thankfuly like you said by Gods Grace thru Jesus Christ we still have Hope!
And Ladybug Interpreted my use of "funny" correctly, sorry for the play on words if it caused any confusion.:thumb

[Ponderin]

The jumping I was refering to, or the way I took it would be the accusation of people on the thred being self-rightous.



I would not call *it a leap, or a jump. But like you said we are different. :lol



Sometimes the threads here about divorce and who did it it right and who did not, have the air about them that I was discribing.

But either way, I'm glad you at least saw things B A N ES way.


:thumb










*Then I got the idea that only people who divorced "the right" way are the "good" people and the rest of us losers should take on projected guilt from the OP and hopelessness to boot because there is no hope for us . . .

But maybe, I have read one to many stock bulletin boards where they set them up and knock them down. You know kinda like a bowling alley?


Any how, that is my 2 cents what I have taken from this and many other threads here. I could be wrong? never the less . . .

Additional Point to Ponder

We are not doing ourselves or anyone a favor by spending our lives wondering "what if " and wishing we had lived like those "other" people who did it right.
.

[bufferb34]

No one called people without biblical divorces losers and the ones with biblical divorces the good people. We don't need to make ridiculous accusations just because some of us have a different understanding regarding what the bible says. I prefer to err on the side of caution. I just want to know the truth and obey the Lord.

What about 1 Corinthians 7:10-11?
Now, for those who are married I have a command that comes not from me but from the Lord. A wife must not leave her husband. But if she does leave him, let her remain single or else go back to him. And the husband must not leave his wife.

[Ponderin]

No one called people without biblical divorces losers and the ones with biblical divorces the good people. We don't need to make ridiculous accusations just because some of us have a different understanding regarding what the bible says. I prefer to err on the side of caution. I just want to know the truth and obey the Lord.

What about 1 Corinthians 7:10-11?
Now, for those who are married I have a command that comes not from me but from the Lord. A wife must not leave her husband. But if she does leave him, let her remain single or else go back to him. And the husband must not leave his wife.


I understand the bible to mean a wife must not leave her husband.
and a husband must not leave his wife. I'm glad you want to obey. That is good.

Now what of those who did not obey?

[boxer77]

I would not call *it a leap, or a jump. But like you said we are different. :lol



Sometimes the threads here about divorce and who did it it right and who did not, have the air about them that I was discribing.

But either way, I'm glad you at least saw things B A N ES way.


:thumb










*Then I got the idea that only people who divorced "the right" way are the "good" people and the rest of us losers should take on projected guilt from the OP and hopelessness to boot because there is no hope for us . . .

But maybe, I have read one to many stock bulletin boards where they set them up and knock them down. You know kinda like a bowling alley?


Any how, that is my 2 cents what I have taken from this and many other threads here. I could be wrong? never the less . . .

Additional Point to Ponder

We are not doing ourselves or anyone a favor by spending our lives wondering "what if " and wishing we had lived like those "other" people who did it right.
.

Amen, I compleately understand.
I do however after some more thinking and studying, dont agree with bane's "formula" somthing is off.
But anyway, the past is the past, and we have to keep looking to the future, satan wants to get people focused on the past, big time, to discourage.

[bufferb34]

I understand the bible to mean a wife must not leave her husband.
and a husband must not leave his wife. I'm glad you want to obey. That is good.

Now what of those who did not obey?

Are you referring to people who did not want the divorce? I don't have all the answers. I wish I did. I just think there are serious warnings in the bible concerning adultery and I think too many people try to create loopholes when there aren't any. If someone wants to risk whatever the punishment may or may not be that is their choice. As I said earlier, I remember when churches would not marry divorced people so obviously I'm not totally wrong regarding my interpretation. Just because divorce and remarriage are so universally accepted does not make it right. This reminds me of the saying if everyone jumped off the bridge would you do it too.

[tkasebier]

I've read about half of all the posts, and I'm glad I stumbled upon this thread. My high school sweetheart and I are rekindling our relationship on the hopes that it will continue into a future marriage. We are both divorced from our previous spouses. I have wrestled with this issue, as I'm sure he has. I am so glad to know that God will bless our (hopeful future) marriage. We have both deeply repented of our divorces.

[Ponderin]

buffer,

No not the good ones. I'm talking about the bad ones.

Like the lady they drug to Jesus feet to trick Him and the Samaritan woman?

[Ponderin]

I've read about half of all the posts, and I'm glad I stumbled upon this thread. My high school sweetheart and I are rekindling our relationship on the hopes that it will continue into a future marriage. We are both divorced from our previous spouses. I have wrestled with this issue, as I'm sure he has. I am so glad to know that God will bless our (hopeful future) marriage. We have both deeply repented of our divorces.

Oh!

How sweet!

:clap

[boxer77]

I've read about half of all the posts, and I'm glad I stumbled upon this thread. My high school sweetheart and I are rekindling our relationship on the hopes that it will continue into a future marriage. We are both divorced from our previous spouses. I have wrestled with this issue, as I'm sure he has. I am so glad to know that God will bless our (hopeful future) marriage. We have both deeply repented of our divorces.

Congratulations on your future wedding! I pray I meet the certain someone.:thumb :nod

[LuvNTruth]

I am divorced. In the book of Matthew, Jesus gives one exceptable reason for divorce, adultry. Even if this is not the reason the person got divorced, if they truely repent, God will forgive them. It is finished. As for remarrage, if the divorce is forgiven then it is forgotten (finished). God tells us that when he forgives us he forgets are transgressions. I believe as long as they put God first in the new marrage and summit to each other, no problem. My opinion.

As I agree with the above post, I don't agree with the one sentence that I bolded. God doesn't FORGET our sins. The bible just says that He "remembers them no more". That means, He chooses NOT to bring them up and basically haunt us with them. It doesn't mean that He forgets them.

Tell your friend that she needs to forgive herself. She's already asked for repentance from Jesus, but if she doesn't forgive herself then she'll really KNOW that she's been forgiven. We've all made mistakes. She just needs to make sure she's growing in her relationship with God and putting GOD first!

[bufferb34]

I don't see how forgiveness of divorce equals remarriage being ok. Of course you can be forgiven for a divorce if you repent but how does that turn remarriage into not being adultery? Being forgiven of divorce does not mean the marriage never existed. If I repent for lying does that make the next lie not a sin? If I repent for stealing does that make lying ok? John the Baptist told the King and his brother's wife it was UNLAWFUL for them to be married. He didn't tell them to repent and it would be ok.

[Writesinme]

Okay...here's one for you. True story:

My sister and her husband (let's call them Mike and Susan) divorced 17 years ago. He had an affair, but tried to end it. The "other woman" was a fatal attraction type--threatened to harm his children, ruin his career and bring rape charges against him. She worked for a prominent judge, had high connections and could have pulled off the ludicrus charges. Long story short, Mike ended up divorcing Susan and marrying the other woman. It was a miserable union and Mike was deeply remorseful for screwing up his first marriage to Susan.

Susan did not remarry, or even date much for that matter.

Two years ago, Mike and Susan's adult son became terminally ill. During the harrowing months that followed, Mike and Susan admitted to one another that they still loved each other. They grew closer, stronger and knew they wanted to remarry.

Mike divorced the woman he had left Susan for. He and Susan are now remarried and deleriously happy. Both are Christians. Susan became one about 10 years after her and Mike's divorce. Mike became one shortly after their son fell ill.

As far as God is concerned, what's right or wrong with any of this? I think about it and my mind starts rolling backwards. Everyone is so thrilled with the reconcilliation and remarriage between these two. We're not sure if either could have survived their son's death without each other--everyone says that God brought them back together and that the timing was no coincidence.

Thoughts anyone? I'd love to hear them.

[CaiperLane]

As I agree with the above post, I don't agree with the one sentence that I bolded. God doesn't FORGET our sins. The bible just says that He "remembers them no more". That means, He chooses NOT to bring them up and basically haunt us with them. It doesn't mean that He forgets them.

Tell your friend that she needs to forgive herself. She's already asked for repentance from Jesus, but if she doesn't forgive herself then she'll really KNOW that she's been forgiven. We've all made mistakes. She just needs to make sure she's growing in her relationship with God and putting GOD first!

...."remembering them no more" IS forgetting. He chooses to forget. Thge King James may use more poetic language. But the correct interpretation is "no more remembering. (That is no recall)

Perhaps the most neglected doctrine of theology is the forgetfulness of God. But this is the good news of God's word. When God forgives, God forgets. This truth is repeatedly affirmed in Scripture. According to the psalmist, God has removed our sin from us as far as east is from west (Psalm 103:12). Jeremiah predicted that when Messiah came, God would forgive all our iniquity and remember our sin no more (Jeremiah 31:34). Micah said God would cast our sins into the deepest sea (Micah 7:19). Paul told the Roman Christians God would forgive our sins and cover them up (Romans 4:7). When God forgives our sin he puts it out of his mind; he erases it from the pages of time; he forgets it.

[Funmudder]

Divorce is tearing apart a covenant made by and with God.

Its over.

Done with.

No longer exists. The marriage is no longer an entity. To say that divorce alone is a cause for some kind of continual sin is trying to say that the marriage is still in effect, still a working covenant, though somehow is tucked away behind a paper saying there was a divorce....

No. A divorce is as a death to marriage. When those papers are signed, there is no more marriage.

We can be forgiven for our part in the divorce should we repent, whether we were saved at that time or not. Repentance does not have a clause feature that says 'repantance only counts as long as it does not include divorce'. If you are sorry for your part in it, then you will be forgiven. period.
God never says He will cause your past to haunt your future. That is the OPPOSITE of forgiveness :doh To say a mistake in your past you have fully repented of would have a role in your future is a man made, legalistic holier than thou idea and is not really supported by scripture unless you eliminate the whole forgiveness of sins bit. We all have mistakes in our past and attempting to use not getting remarried as a 'one upmanship' card is rather silly. Who cares if one person decided to punish themselves the rest of their life for something God forgave them of long ago? While its quite sad and lonely for that person, that doesn't mean diddly to the rest of us who have fallen on our faces in joy to the Lords great love, mercy and grace by sending us the spouse He wanted us to have.

Since when does God say "You are forgiven, but because you were naughty, I expect you to live the rest of your life in lonliness." :wacko
No, the Lord says "You are forgiven, now go and sin no more"
Your past is forgotten. He hates divorce, but not you.

Get remarried,the first is no longer remembered in His eyes, live the new marriage with the hard lessons learned from your tragic first in mind and be joyful His grace is sufficent to not remember your past mistakes. The Lord did not create us to live our lives alone.
God does not hold grudges. I do not for one second believe a divorced person cannot get remarried any more than someone who did not retain their virginity before their first marriage.
All sexual sin, including adultery, and sex before marriage is considered equally sinful before the Lord. You honestly repent and go on from there. For that matter ALL sin is just as equal in the eyes of the Lord, so why is it that the divorced are singled out as the ones that must drag their shame around behind them for the rest of their lives? :tsk

I'm glad the Lord grants more grace than some peoples perpetual shamefilled interpretations are willing to concede. How sad.

[Funmudder]

...."remembering them no more" IS forgetting. He chooses to forget. Thge King James may use more poetic language. But the correct interpretation is "no more remembering. (That is no recall)

Perhaps the most neglected doctrine of theology is the forgetfulness of God. But this is the good news of God's word. When God forgives, God forgets. This truth is repeatedly affirmed in Scripture. According to the psalmist, God has removed our sin from us as far as east is from west (Psalm 103:12). Jeremiah predicted that when Messiah came, God would forgive all our iniquity and remember our sin no more (Jeremiah 31:34). Micah said God would cast our sins into the deepest sea (Micah 7:19). Paul told the Roman Christians God would forgive our sins and cover them up (Romans 4:7). When God forgives our sin he puts it out of his mind; he erases it from the pages of time; he forgets it.

Amen! Absolutely! :nod :thumb

[Dana67]

buffer,

No not the good ones. I'm talking about the bad ones.

Like the lady they drug to Jesus feet to trick Him and the Samaritan woman?


Good or bad what?

[boxer77]

"I'm glad the Lord grants more grace than some peoples perpetual shamefilled interpretations are willing to concede. How sad."

2 Timothy 2:24-26
24 And a servant of the Lord must not quarrel but be gentle to all, able to teach, patient, 25 in humility correcting those who are in opposition, if God perhaps will grant them repentance, so that they may know the truth, 26 and that they may come to their senses and escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by him to do his will.

New King James Version (NKJV)

[Dana67]

How gentle are these posts to the divorced and remarried believer? Those believers that have already been granted repentance by God... Divorce is not an easy thing to live through, whether you are the petitioner or the respondent, and I'm certain that those divorced for whatever reason don't appreciate having their pasts thrown up before them "in humility".

[boxer77]

that is what the verse is talking about, its saying not to be crude or hostile, but share the truth with humility.
If they have already found peace with God on the issue, then why come here to this thred and re-kindel all those memorys? Its like pouring salt in a wound.
BTW that top part of my post above was a qoute. Not my words.

Kirk Camron has the way of the master ministry, he goes up and shares Gods word with them humbly, and some people get all offended, people that are guilty or have a lot of pride get all puffed up and say all kinds of things, except agreeing that they are sinners.
We can share our convictions about what Gods word says, some will disagree, but it dosent make another group of people self rightous cause they see a verse in the bible a diffrent way. Its all how its presented I guess.

[Funmudder]

Now, is it just my imagination, or does it appear that some people here are interpreting scripture to not remarry as a way to ensure salvation? Isn't that a work?

New marriage is not a continuation of sin, it is a new union. We are sexual creatures, thats why sex is so rampantly and easily used to lure us off the right path. How would denying yourself the natural feelings you would have towards the opposite sex (living in lust) be more glorifying to the Lord than to remarry and live the new marriage according to His word?

Now while I completely agree that serial marriages and divorces are clearly not in line with the seriousness of Gods word, I don't see how true repantance would not cover our sinful past and allow for a new marriage to be built on Gods rock.

[Dana67]

Yes, I understand that is what the verse is discussing, sharing the truth with humility to those who are in opposition. If God has forgiven, then they're not in opposition.

[boxer77]

Yes, I understand that is what the verse is discussing, sharing the truth with humility to those who are in opposition. If God has forgiven, then they're not in opposition.

Agreed.:nod

[boxer77]

Now, is it just my imagination, or does it appear that some people here are interpreting scripture to not remarry as a way to ensure salvation? Isn't that a work?

New marriage is not a continuation of sin, it is a new union. We are sexual creatures, thats why sex is so rampantly and easily used to lure us off the right path. How would denying yourself the natural feelings you would have towards the opposite sex (living in lust) be more glorifying to the Lord than to remarry and live the new marriage according to His word?

Now while I completely agree that serial marriages and divorces are clearly not in line with the seriousness of Gods word, I don't see how true repantance would not cover our sinful past and allow for a new marriage to be built on Gods rock.


Its just your Imagination, its not the unpardonable sin, of course, cause there is only one, Jesus died for all of our sins past present and future.

1 Corinthians 7
Principles of Marriage
1 Now concerning the things of which you wrote to me:
It is good for a man not to touch a woman. 2 Nevertheless, because of sexual immorality, let each man have his own wife, and let each woman have her own husband. 3 Let the husband render to his wife the affection due her, and likewise also the wife to her husband. 4 The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does. And likewise the husband does not have authority over his own body, but the wife does. 5 Do not deprive one another except with consent for a time, that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer; and come together again so that Satan does not tempt you because of your lack of self-control. 6 But I say this as a concession, not as a commandment. 7 For I wish that all men were even as I myself. But each one has his own gift from God, one in this manner and another in that.
8 But I say to the unmarried and to the widows: It is good for them if they remain even as I am; 9 but if they cannot exercise self-control, let them marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion.
Keep Your Marriage Vows

10 Now to the married I command, yet not I but the Lord: A wife is not to depart from her husband. 11 But even if she does depart, let her remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband. And a husband is not to divorce his wife.
12 But to the rest I, not the Lord, say: If any brother has a wife who does not believe, and she is willing to live with him, let him not divorce her. 13 And a woman who has a husband who does not believe, if he is willing to live with her, let her not divorce him. 14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband; otherwise your children would be unclean, but now they are holy. 15 But if the unbeliever departs, let him depart; a brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases. But God has called us to peace. 16 For how do you know, O wife, whether you will save your husband? Or how do you know, O husband, whether you will save your wife?

[OneDayNearer]

Okay...here's one for you. True story:

My sister and her husband (let's call them Mike and Susan) divorced 17 years ago. He had an affair, but tried to end it. The "other woman" was a fatal attraction type--threatened to harm his children, ruin his career and bring rape charges against him. She worked for a prominent judge, had high connections and could have pulled off the ludicrus charges. Long story short, Mike ended up divorcing Susan and marrying the other woman. It was a miserable union and Mike was deeply remorseful for screwing up his first marriage to Susan.

Susan did not remarry, or even date much for that matter.

Two years ago, Mike and Susan's adult son became terminally ill. During the harrowing months that followed, Mike and Susan admitted to one another that they still loved each other. They grew closer, stronger and knew they wanted to remarry.

Mike divorced the woman he had left Susan for. He and Susan are now remarried and deleriously happy. Both are Christians. Susan became one about 10 years after her and Mike's divorce. Mike became one shortly after their son fell ill.

As far as God is concerned, what's right or wrong with any of this? I think about it and my mind starts rolling backwards. Everyone is so thrilled with the reconcilliation and remarriage between these two. We're not sure if either could have survived their son's death without each other--everyone says that God brought them back together and that the timing was no coincidence.

Thoughts anyone? I'd love to hear them.

Wow!! This is soooooooo beautiful! God was so merciful to bring this couple back together. What a testimony to the faithfulness and tenderness of God and His desire to bring healing and restoration to His children.

Thank you writesinme for sharing!

[AnotherOldGuy]

I don't see how true repantance would not cover our sinful past and allow for a new marriage to be built on Gods rock.

God's Rock gives us His opinion:

(Mat 5:32) "But I say to you that whoever divorces his wife for any reason except sexual immorality cau