Satan

[zeeker]

Hey All. our Sunday School Class was on Satan and it was when he rebelled against God and when God cast him out of Heaven. I was wondering how could Satan Sin and Rebell against God and thought that he could be higher than God.Like were would that thought come from when Satan was in Heaven.

[Morgan]

This is a good question. I immediately think of free will. God created beings with free will rather than robots. It wasn't that sin was in heaven but the option was always there - as with Adam and Eve in the Garden. All sin IMHO begins with removing God from the number one place in our hearts and seating ourselves there. That is what Satan did.

I believe that the whole purpose to our earthly existence is learning the results from our sin of doing things according to our wants and desires and wisdom and igoring God. The results here on earth are physical and emotional pain, emptiness, loss of peace. This of course is on a smaller scale then the eternal results. God wants us to learn and then to choose Him for all the right reasons. Again, this is simply my opinion and anyone can correct me if I am saying this wrong.

And those who learn that their ways are wrong and learn that God's ways are right and to trust Him by putting their faith in Jesus, will be spending eternity with Him. Because, we will still always have free will but the errors of our judgment will have been tested here and not in heaven.

This is just thinking out loud what I have summarized in my own mind as to the purpose of this life and the way heaven will be living eternity with only those who 'get it' and not with those who are eternally convinced that their wisdom is higher than God's.

Does that make sense? Or am I totally off target with your question?

On a side note - I heard a great comedian, Jeff Allen, give his opinion about Satan's fall - Jeff is convinced Satan was a teenager at the time as all kids rebel in their teens! :pound

[ub4war]

"How art thou fallen from heaven,
O Lucifer, son of the morning!
how art thou cut down to the ground,
which didst weaken the nations!"
(Interlinear) "O shining star, son of morning,
how you have fallen from the heavens...
For you said in your heart,
I will go up to the heavens;
I will raise my throne above the stars of God,
and I will sit in the mount of meeting
in the sides of the north...
I will be compared to the most high."


Ezekial 28:
You were the anointed cherub
that covers, and I had put you
in the holy height of God...
YOU WALKED UP AND DOWN
IN THE MIDST OF THE STONES OF FIRE...
You were perfect in your ways from the day
you were created, until iniquity was found in you.


3 Behold you are wiser than Daniel;
every one of the secret things
is not hidden to you...
15 You were perfect in your ways
from the day you were created,
until iniquity was found in you.
16 By the multitude of your trade
they filled your midst with violence, and you sinned.
So I cast you profaned from the height of God,
AND I DESTROYED YOU,
OH COVERING CHERUB,
FROM AMONG THE STONES OF FIRE...
18 By the host of your iniquities,
by the iniquity of your trade,
you have profaned your holy places;
thus I brought a fire from your midst;
When Satan and his angels rebelled, God destroyed their literal dwelling places. According to scripture this destruction was swift and decisive.

Job 26:11-13:
The pillars of heaven are stunned at His rebuke.
He quiets The sea with his power,
- and by his understanding
He shatters (maw-khats, dashes asunder), Rahab,
-by His spirit the heavens were beautiful;
His hand forbids the fugitive snake

[Jacob]

Hey All. our Sunday School Class was on Satan and it was when he rebelled against God and when God cast him out of Heaven. I was wondering how could Satan Sin and Rebell against God and thought that he could be higher than God.Like were would that thought come from when Satan was in Heaven.
That is the $64 dollar question. Since God is sinless, and he cannot allow sin to be in His presence, then where did Lucifer's (Satan) pride and sin come from?

That is one of those questions that we will have to wait for the answer until we get to heaven.

[Hootmon]

'Iniquity' isnt synonymous with 'Sin'.

Iniquity is the propensity to make the wrong choice; the 'potential' for Sin. It doesnt become Sin itself until the wrong choice is made (unrighteousness) and acted on (Sin).

[POBsn]

The thing I've always wondered is why Jesus didn't offer angels a path to salvation. Why is it that people who sin are offered a path of forgiveness yet Lucifer and the angels who chose to follow him are not?

[B A N E]

It is arguable that humans start in relative ignorance and the angels did not.

The Scriptural argument is God chose to do it this way.
Beyond that?
:noidea

[Hootmon]

The thing I've always wondered is why Jesus didn't offer angels a path to salvation. Why is it that people who sin are offered a path of forgiveness yet Lucifer and the angels who chose to follow him are not?They are exactly opposite scenarios.

The Angels chose to rebel dispite having close proximity/experience of God.

Humans choose God despite not having that sort of access.

[MNGirl]

Lucifer's sin was pride.

[James 1:22]

Lucifer's sin was pride

and still is today

[boxer77]

Down here on earth we all have our interpretations of satans name, but I wonder what God called him in heaven.... you know like a heavenly language, cause Lucifer is from the vulgate.
Mabey IM thinking to much..:rolleyes I mean are we going to be using english or will we be using a language to talk to God, or just or minds, but then again we would think in english, wow, sorry for the hijack, back to topic.:thumb

[My Abba's Child]

The thing I've always wondered is why Jesus didn't offer angels a path to salvation. Why is it that people who sin are offered a path of forgiveness yet Lucifer and the angels who chose to follow him are not?

I think it's because angels were actually THERE, in heaven, IN HIS PRESENCE yet still chose to reject their Creator... they see Him as He truly is. Whereas, we humans don't have that luxury yet. The Bible says that, when we meet the Lord in the clouds, we will be like Him for we shall see Him as He truly is. Like Him... we're already fashioned in His image, right? I think this "Like Him" is going to be the perfection and Oneness with the will of God that will allow us to live in complete righteousness, faithfulness and knowledge that all of God's ways are perfect that will keep sin from us forevermore. But, it will be brought about because we will SEE Him as He truly is (which Satan and his demons have already had that advantage and threw it away). I don't know if any of this makes sense... my brain's already in bed asleep... I'd better get the rest of me to follow suit. :lol

In His love,

[GregInMn]

If angels still have free will, is it possible there may be another rebellion by another angel?

[Hootmon]

If angels still have free will, is it possible there may be another rebellion by another angel?The sides have already been chosen. I dont think either side can 'unchoose'.

[OwnedByJesus]

The thing I've always wondered is why Jesus didn't offer angels a path to salvation. Why is it that people who sin are offered a path of forgiveness yet Lucifer and the angels who chose to follow him are not?

Is this true?

Colossians 1:19-20 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.

[Hootmon]

Interesting Scripture.

I wouldnt read too much into it though. If the 'reconciliation of all things in heaven and earth' includes Stan and his demons, it also includes unbelievers. I doubt that is the case.

In other words, it may include all types of things, but not every individual thing.

Here is the CJB rendering in context...

He [the Father] has rescued us from the domain of darkness and transferred us into the Kingdom of his dear Son. It is through his Son that we have redemption - that is, our sins have been forgiven.

He [the Son] is the visible image of the invisible God. He is supreme over all creation, because in connection with him were created all things - in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, lordships, rulers or authorities - they have all been created through him and for him. He existed before all things, and he holds everything together.

Also he is head of the Body, the Messianic Community - he is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that he might hold first place in everything. For it pleased God to have his full being live in his Son and through his Son to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace through him, through having his Son shed his blood by being executed on a stake.

In other words, you, who at one time were separated from God and had a hostile attitude towards him because of your wicked deeds, he has now reconciled in the Son's physical body through his death; in order to present you holy and without defect or reproach before himself - provided, of course, that you continue in your trusting, grounded and steady, and don't let yourselves be moved away from the hope offered in the Good News you heard. This is the Good News that has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven; and I, Sha'ul, have become a servant of it.
(Col 1:13-23)

[OwnedByJesus]

Interesting Scripture.

I wouldnt read too much into it though. If the 'reconciliation of all things in heaven and earth' includes Stan and his demons, it also includes unbelievers. I doubt that is the case.
Is this the same 'Stan' that we had in our avatar? :lol

In other words, it may include all types of things, but not every individual thing.

Right, not by default everything or everyone. To reconcile is to reestablish a close relationship. So there is room, I believe, in the verse for angles to come back to God. As for Satan, he will not. God knows this and tells us of his doom and all those that reject Him. Yet, though we have rejected Him, He has made a way for us to come back to Him. That's great news for those that accept it!

Here is the CJB rendering in context...

He [the Father] has rescued us from the domain of darkness and transferred us into the Kingdom of his dear Son. It is through his Son that we have redemption - that is, our sins have been forgiven.

He [the Son] is the visible image of the invisible God. He is supreme over all creation, because in connection with him were created all things - in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, lordships, rulers or authorities - they have all been created through him and for him. He existed before all things, and he holds everything together.

Also he is head of the Body, the Messianic Community - he is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that he might hold first place in everything. For it pleased God to have his full being live in his Son and through his Son to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace through him, through having his Son shed his blood by being executed on a stake.

In other words, you, who at one time were separated from God and had a hostile attitude towards him because of your wicked deeds, he has now reconciled in the Son's physical body through his death; in order to present you holy and without defect or reproach before himself - provided, of course, that you continue in your trusting, grounded and steady, and don't let yourselves be moved away from the hope offered in the Good News you heard. This is the Good News that has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven; and I, Sha'ul, have become a servant of it.
(Col 1:13-23)

[Hootmon]

Is this the same 'Stan' that we had in our avatar? :lol :doh

:rofl

Drat that Stan!