The taxman cometh for Joyce Meyer

[Diane 1611]

http://www.kmov.com/topstories/stories/kmov_localnews_060503_mocjoycemeyers.5802597.html


Joyce Meyer Ministries’ tax filing could cost county

08:20 AM CDT on Wednesday, May 3, 2006

Fenton (KMOV) -- If the initial tax filing by the Joyce Meyer Ministries goes through, Jefferson County schools and other agencies would lose hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Last November, Meyer's Fenton based ministries agreed to pay $1 million in taxes. But in the March filing the ministries list less than $500,000 in personal property, a fraction of the $16 million they declared in 2005.

The ministries issued a statement saying, “Joyce Meyer Ministries” is in the final stages of submitting a second report… This is still an ongoing process."

There is video to watch and user comments at the link.


A photo of Joyce Meyer's complex:
http://www.kmov.com/topstories/stories/L_IMAGE.107b66b0d7a.93.88.fa.7c.1be7898.jpg

Edited to removed hotlinked image

[sandy111]

sounds fishy to me.

and name it claim it is'nt working quit so well.
wonder if she figures she just cant keep that faith up there yet?
(just being scarcasic) as we all know its not biblical to begin with.

[Jany]

If she is a Christian - a true believer, she should pay "unto Caesar" - why the hubbub? <><

[babylonrising]

I live near her..... In fact, I ran into her in Fenton once. Very disturbing lady. She certainly doesn't like to talk to people unless it's on a tape she can sell.
You should see her actual house. It's gorgeous. If I remember, I'll take a pic with my cam sometime and post it here.
I personally can't stand her, but I'd love to have that house.

[lookup]

edited to delete post

[Dianne]

Hi,
I am so suprised that there is negative talk about her. I have read her books and listened to her tapes and every morning to her sermons on the internet.
I have been so distressed and having problems with my faith. She has helped me a great deal to grow in my faith and I really felt God was speaking to me through her. I think she is awesome. I felt like she was down to earth and has really reached me to grow in Christ. So it was so disappointing to here that people don't like her and feel that there is something fishy about her taxes. Help me. I have trusted the Lord to teach me through her. I feel like crying.

[Singlesis]

((((( Dianne ))))) It's okay. There are many of us who loved Joyce, and her books and seminars have helped a lot of us through certain struggles in our life. Her appeal is that she teaches in such a "down to earth" style, like we can all relate to her.

But sadly, she has fallen in the WoF camp, and as most of us found out the hard way, things in big ministries are not always (or not usually) as they seem. So many of them get caught up in the fame and fortune, they lose sight of their first love.

I too have some of her books that are quite good. But I no longer give any $$ to her ministry. There are many here who can tell you more about some of her false teaching. I pray they will do it with kindness and love.

Praying for God to reveal the truth to you, and to all of us always.

[Singlesis]

I live near her..... In fact, I ran into her in Fenton once. Very disturbing lady. She certainly doesn't like to talk to people unless it's on a tape she can sell.
You should see her actual house. It's gorgeous. If I remember, I'll take a pic with my cam sometime and post it here.
I personally can't stand her, but I'd love to have that house.
Hey friend! :wave

Tell us more about running in to Joyce. Why do you say she is a "disturbing lady"? What happened?

[wsbsteven]

That building is like 2-3 miles down the road from me. Her million dollar homes have been on sale for awhile now.

[Hoping4TheCall]

when the IRS gets done with her and her ministry many christains will finally open their EYES, I hope...
Once she might have been taught sound and lived sound bibically, but since getting into the WoF movement, her teachings are not very sound bibically.
I wish I had a link to the website that list how much she is 'paid' her husband and family is paid.. basically they are living the great american dream off of people sending them donations.. what happened to putting christ first ?
I see her and think if that is modern Christiananity, I don't want a part of it..

[Diane 1611]

Dianne, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch ran a very revealing series of articles about Joyce and her ministry in 2003. I posted them on here, but I found a link for you on the Post-Dispatch web site so you and anyone else who wants to can read them. Here it is:

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/front?openview&count=2000

Here are the stories from day 1 of the series (I don't think if you click on the underlined words you can get to the story, unfortunately):

Summary: From Fenton to fame (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/18C14871599F61AC86256DDD0081B42B?OpenDocument)11/13/2003
Joyce Meyer says God has made her rich. [more] (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/18C14871599F61AC86256DDD0081B42B?OpenDocument)

Full story: From Fenton to fortune in the name of God (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/C5099399D2FCC5FA86256DDF00661C5F?OpenDocument)11/15/2003
Joyce Meyer’s Fenton-based TV ministry has touched millions around the world, making the self-made Meyer wealthy. Supporters say it’s honest pay for doing God’s work. Some tax experts charge that she may violate federal laws that bar preachers from using church funds as their own. [more] (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/C5099399D2FCC5FA86256DDF00661C5F?OpenDocument)


Meyer traces her fervor to early abuse, alcohol[/URL]11/15/2003
[URL="http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/1D29266A7F855B2886256DDF00701F8A?OpenDocument"][more] (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/1D29266A7F855B2886256DDF00701F8A?OpenDocument)

IRS requires pay, perks for evangelists to be "reasonable" (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/02BC58FDFFE6454C86256DDF00701F89?OpenDocument)11/15/2003
[more] (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/02BC58FDFFE6454C86256DDF00701F89?OpenDocument)

Jefferson County, Meyer joust over tax exemption (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/7C0D90DB0AF048E286256DDF00701F8B?OpenDocument)11/15/2003
Assessor Randy Holman says the headquarters of Joyce Meyer Ministries is a business. Meyer says it is used for religious purposes and therefore is tax-exempt. [more] (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/special/joycemeyer.nsf/0/7C0D90DB0AF048E286256DDF00701F8B?OpenDocument)

[Diane 1611]

If the link I posted above doesn't work, you can do a search for Joyce Meyer at the Post-Dispatch website at http://www.stltoday.com. (http://www.stltoday.com)

[SilverLHS]

I live near her..... In fact, I ran into her in Fenton once. Very disturbing lady. She certainly doesn't like to talk to people unless it's on a tape she can sell.
You should see her actual house. It's gorgeous. If I remember, I'll take a pic with my cam sometime and post it here.
I personally can't stand her, but I'd love to have that house.
STOP!
Think about what you're saying and how you're saying it before you do another post in regards to this.
"I personally can't stand her." "I'd love to have that house". I can think of several teachings in the Bible that discourage these thoughts.
I am sick to death of these Joyce Myer bashing threads. It's one thing to expose false teaching, it's another entirely to GOSSIP.

[Dianne]

You know what, I have placed a lot of trust and faith in the Lord. I felt that He was teaching me throught her lessons. I feel like I am losing faith again.
How can I ever trust any one to teach the true word of God. How do I know if my minister is the way to learn God's message, He teaches from the Bible, but maybe something I don't know about him is wrong. Why would God lead me in the woring direction all this time. Is this one of satans tricks to confuse me and pull me away from God and mistrust him. Do I now throw joyce meyers books away. What should I do? So why bother reading or listening to messages of God. God certainly does not come down and talk with me personally.

[Grace]

Dianne, try reading the Bible yourself and ask the Holy Spirit to reveal the truth of the message to you. Your faith should not be wrapped up in a teacher, but in the Word. And you don't need an earthly teacher to reveal His Word to your heart.

[Becky]

Dianne, never put your faith in any man or woman. There are good teachers and preachers out there. But these type of people who fall into the Word of Faith cult need our prayers. Joyce started out like most of those teachers/preachers did: with sound teaching from the Word of God. Then she fell off into the pit of false teaching.

Always, always, always make sure whoever is teaching or preaching stays with the Word of God. :thumb The Bereans were a group of people who even questioned Paul to make sure he was teaching them correctly. They were looking up the scriptures to make sure what he was teaching was from the Word of God.

If they can question Paul, an Apostle who walked with Jesus, then we can question any and all teachers and preachers. :nod

[babylonrising]

I was at the big Target store in Fenton. She came in with a really tall guy, I'm guessing it was her husband.
I had just come from the Water Park (Riverchase) in Fenton with my daughters, my neice and nephew, and a couple of my daughters friends. We had a very full car load.
They were walking towards the checkout lines as we were walking to the back of the store towards the electronics section.
I'm sure we looked like a group of hippies since we had been in the pool all day long.
I had never seen her in person. When she walked by, I was trying to be really friendly and said, "Aren't you Joyce Meyers?" She gave me an ackward look and kept on walking.
Ok, I guess I can see why she looked at me like I was an idiot, but c'mon......... You would think a 'lady of God' would have at least said hi, smiled, or nodded her head.... Anything but looking at me like I was a weirdo.

[Dianne]

Well this is what I have to say. I never placed my faith in anyone but God.
I trust God in what He is doing in my life and I can't believe that He would lead my down the wrong path. I believe He reachs me through Joyce Meyers.
So to talk in such a bad way about her, giving own opinion or judgement and not knowing the facts can really upset a person and destroy their faith. That is not what God wants. Joce Meyers gives an account of her finances in a report on the web site. Also you can't believe everything the media says

[Becky]

Well this is what I have to say. I never placed my faith in anyone but God.
I trust God in what He is doing in my life and I can't believe that He would lead my down the wrong path. I believe He reachs me through Joyce Meyers.
So to talk in such a bad way about her, giving own opinion or judgement and not knowing the facts can really upset a person and destroy their faith. That is not what God wants. Joce Meyers gives an account of her finances in a report on the web site. Also you can't believe everything the media saysThis isn't a media thing, Dianne. We have researched and heard from Joyce Meyers herself. If you do a search you can find many threads where we have discussed the problems we have found with her and scripture. She has changed. :sigh

Here are her own words:

Meyer is well known for her claims of being able to live a sinfree life. She parrots the atonement atrocities authored by Kenneth Copeland. Her ministry threatened to sue me for using her picture on the site, so that is why her photo has been replaced by the black box. A copy of this conversation can be found here (http://www.bereanfaith.com/heresy/meyersuit.htm).
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The cross wasn't enough, Jesus redeemed us in hell

"And you've got to really glean some things out of the Word of God to really get hold of what He [Jesus] did for you during those three days. Jesus said, 'It is finished.' And He meant the Old Covenant. The job He had to do was just getting started. He really did the job the three days and nights that He was in hell. That's where the job was done."
Joyce Meyer (What Happened from the Cross to The Throne? audio)

"He was pronounced guilty on the cross but He paid the price in hell."
Joyce Meyer (What Happened from the Cross to The Throne? audio)

"There is no hope of anyone going to heaven unless they believe this truth I am presenting. You cannot go to heaven unless you believe with all your heart that Jesus took your place in hell"
Joyce Meyer ("The Most Important Decision You Will Ever Make", 1991 pg. 3)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jesus was the first born again man

"God rose up from His throne and said to demon powers tormenting the sinless Son of God, 'Let Him go.' Then the resurrection power of Almighty God went through hell and filled Jesus. He was resurrected from the dead -- the first born-again man"
Joyce Meyer ("The Most Important Decision You Will Ever Make", 1991 pg. 36)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Above Reproach - testing their spirits

"The Bible can't even find any way to explain this. Not really. That's why you've got to get it by revelation. There are no words to explain what I'm telling you. I've got to just trust God that He's putting it into your spirit like He put it into mine."
Joyce Meyer (What Happened from the Cross to The Throne? audio)

Meyer says "that the changed lives are proof enough," that she's "anointed by God to do what I'm doing."
Joyce Meyer (Charisma, pg. 55)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sinfree!

"I'm going to tell you something folks, I didn't stop sinning until I finally got it through my thick head I wasn't a sinner anymore. And the religious world thinks that's heresy and they want to hang you for it. But the Bible says that I'm righteous and I can't be righteous and be a sinner at the same time. All I was ever taught to say was, 'I'm a poor, miserable sinner.' I am not poor, I am not miserable and I am not a sinner. That is a lie from the pit of hell. That is what I was and if I still am then Jesus died in vain. Amen?"
Joyce Meyer (What Happened from the Cross to The Throne? audio)

"I might as well go and smack Him right in the face if I'm going to go around and feel guilty and condemned. Every time you feel guilty and condemned it's just like slapping Him in the face and saying, You didn't do a good job. You didn't do a complete job. I'm an old rotten this and I'm an old rotten that."
Joyce Meyer (What Happened from the Cross to The Throne? audio)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Angels tell me what to say

"Now spirits don't have bodies, so we can't see them. Okay? There probably is, I believe there is, and I certainly hope there is several angels up here this morning that are preaching with me. I believe that right before I speak some anointed statement to you, that one of them bends over and says in my ear what I'm supposed to say to you."
Joyce Meyer (Witchcraft & Related Spirits (Part 1) - 2 A-27 Audiotape)
www.bereanfaith.com (http://www.bereanfaith.com)

[Dianne]

Cont. I will continue with my life and learning God's message not only by Joyce but Beth Moore ect. I believe Satan is trying to discourage me, tear me down and mislead me. I won't let that happen, I don't beleive in judgjng people, saying such negative things and bad things. I just got on this site because i thought I would learn & grow spiritually, not confused and upset, so I feel that I will have to say good bye. I Dianne

[Becky]

Say what? :confused

I'm sorry you feel that way Dianne. Please remember; have faith in God, not man/woman. I hope you are not mislead by anyone. And I hope you take the time to read my post above using Joyce's own words.

God told us to judge righteously. We are also warned by Jesus about false teachers. Please keep your Bible open and ready when someone is teaching. And do some research to make sure these people are not or have become corrupt in the Word of God.

[Becky]

And just to add: We don't like gossip either. :thumb So go to the source and know what these teachers are teaching.

[Selah]

Cont. I will continue with my life and learning God's message not only by Joyce but Beth Moore ect. I believe Satan is trying to discourage me, tear me down and mislead me. I won't let that happen, I don't beleive in judgjng people, saying such negative things and bad things. I just got on this site because i thought I would learn & grow spiritually, not confused and upset, so I feel that I will have to say good bye. I Dianne


Dianne--

You might be saying that you don't place your faith in Joyce, but if you let comments by others (that you refuse to investigate for yourself) affect your actions (such as making a decision not to come to the message board anymore), then you are placing some measure of your faith in her above researching for yourself to find out the truth. That means you are choosing to put your trust in what Joyce says rather than look into the mirror of truth and investigate. :(:

The biblical response to claims with evidence presented is to research and ask for discernment. If you do not, then you will be "tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting" (Ephesians 4:14).

Why do you think Jesus and the apostles spent so much time warning us against false teachers?

1 But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3 By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber. (2 Peter 2)

1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world...6 We are of God. He who knows God hears us; he who is not of God does not hear us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error. (1 John 4)

21 Test all things; hold fast what is good. (1 Thess 5)

24 Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment. (John 7:)

And all of Matthew 7, basically...(for example, "20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them...").

This is something especially true if we are living in the last days! Jesus said the number of false teachers and prophets would increase...!

You will be perfectly safe, as long as you place your trust in Him and not in man. ("He who is in you is greater than he who is in the world." 1 John 4) That means we must be Bereans! :):

"And this I pray, that your love may abound still more and more in knowledge and all discernment." (Philippians 1:9)

:D:

[Grace]

Well this is what I have to say. I never placed my faith in anyone but God.
I trust God in what He is doing in my life and I can't believe that He would lead my down the wrong path. I believe He reachs me through Joyce Meyers.
So to talk in such a bad way about her, giving own opinion or judgement and not knowing the facts can really upset a person and destroy their faith. That is not what God wants. Joce Meyers gives an account of her finances in a report on the web site. Also you can't believe everything the media says


Dianne, if your faith is only in God, then how can your faith be destroyed if you believe someone is "giving own opinion or judgement and not knowing the facts?" That does not make sense. Please think this over. Either your faith is in God alone, thereby making it irrelevant as to what others believe about certain teachers, OR your faith is in a teacher, thereby making the opinions of others about the teacher relevant.

Becky is 110% correct in her assesment that it is Joyce's own words which prove what kind of teacher she really is. We are to question those who teach us so that we are not fooled by false teachers. Look at the words of Joyce posted by Becky and then review Scripture. Do the teachings of Joyce line up with the Word of God???

[Dianne]

Grace,
My faith is only in God and your right, why would I feel that my faith is destroyed because of other peoples opinion or judgement. That is something I have to look inside myself and figure what is going on. I just want to learn the word of God, I have asked the Holy Spirit to help me understand, but I still have difficulty, I learn best from teachings by pastor sermons, bible studies, books and tapes. And I agree that it has to be by Gods words.

[Dianne]

contine to Grace, I can understand what you are saying to me and I certainly will be thinking and praying on this. It is not really about Joyce Meyer that is bothering me, but I am not sure what is bothering me. I cried today and prayed to God that I just wanted to be close to Him and learn about his teachings and to help me to sort out the messages that I have recieved today. I take Jesus very seriously and that is why I have reacted so upset.

[tommyg]

Grace,
My faith is only in God and your right, why would I feel that my faith is destroyed because of other peoples opinion or judgement. That is something I have to look inside myself and figure what is going on. I just want to learn the word of God, I have asked the Holy Spirit to help me understand, but I still have difficulty, I learn best from teachings by pastor sermons, bible studies, books and tapes. And I agree that it has to be by Gods words.

Well there are alot of good ones out there,Charles Stanley,Billy Graham just to name of few.

[Grace]

Grace,
My faith is only in God and your right, why would I feel that my faith is destroyed because of other peoples opinion or judgement. That is something I have to look inside myself and figure what is going on. I just want to learn the word of God, I have asked the Holy Spirit to help me understand, but I still have difficulty, I learn best from teachings by pastor sermons, bible studies, books and tapes. And I agree that it has to be by Gods words.


Do you have a Church that you attend regularly? In my opinion, it is important to find a Church which is rock solid in doctine and become an active member. Not only can you learn from sermons and interactions in Sunday school, but you also can fellowship with other believers. From my own personal experience, I have learned much through one on one discussions with my pastor as well as "chats" with other Church members while having dinner on the grounds. :hungry (I am Baptist --- we eat alot! :heh)

Keep studying and I'll be praying for you.:nod

[Dianne]

Yes, Iam very active in my church and with other believers. Yes I also have dinner on the grounds and yes there will be various opinions from different christians and like me there are some christians who like Joyce Meyers and learn a lot from her, but I plan to talk with my pastor, and get help in this area and move on from there.

[lookup]

I was at the big Target store in Fenton. She came in with a really tall guy, I'm guessing it was her husband.
I had just come from the Water Park (Riverchase) in Fenton with my daughters, my neice and nephew, and a couple of my daughters friends. We had a very full car load.
They were walking towards the checkout lines as we were walking to the back of the store towards the electronics section.
I'm sure we looked like a group of hippies since we had been in the pool all day long.
I had never seen her in person. When she walked by, I was trying to be really friendly and said, "Aren't you Joyce Meyers?" She gave me an ackward look and kept on walking.
Ok, I guess I can see why she looked at me like I was an idiot, but c'mon......... You would think a 'lady of God' would have at least said hi, smiled, or nodded her head.... Anything but looking at me like I was a weirdo.

While I am very concerned about JM's recent teachings, I really don't think you can base whether or not someone is a false teacher or even a snooty person on the above ('course, I wasn't there). I know I've been accused of being antisocial before, when I didn't immediately acknowledge someone. But there are times when I'm just preoccupied with something on my mind, or I just don't hear the person speaking. I might be a hard-of-hearing absent-minded person, but not antisocial or a bad Christian.

[lookup]

contine to Grace, I can understand what you are saying to me and I certainly will be thinking and praying on this. It is not really about Joyce Meyer that is bothering me, but I am not sure what is bothering me. I cried today and prayed to God that I just wanted to be close to Him and learn about his teachings and to help me to sort out the messages that I have recieved today. I take Jesus very seriously and that is why I have reacted so upset.
Dianne,

I'm praying with you about this. Know that the Lord wants you to get close to Him even more than you do, and that you can certainly trust Him to be faithful to help you do this.

One thing I've found helpful when evaluating whether a message or teaching is gospel-worthy, (in addition, of course, to it being true to God's Word), is to ask, "Who is this lifting up? Is the speaker giving me more information about the speaker, or about Jesus? Who or what does the speaker like to talk about the most?"

I think that it is very important that when a teacher is done teaching, you remember more about God and His Word than you do about them. Even when the speaker is teaching about very practical, down-to-earth things.

When you're hungry for more of Jesus (and it certainly sounds like you are), you will know when you hear this kind of teaching, because it will satisfy that desire. Anything else just won't do it.

*edited to add this:

You can also ask the Lord to help you understand His Word more yourself when you read and study on your own. And it is vital that you are doing this. No preacher or teacher should be a substitute for the time you spend with the Lord yourself. (And, of course, your own time with the Lord will only help you be more discerning about the teachings and sermons you hear.)

[markofthebest]

STOP!
Think about what you're saying and how you're saying it before you do another post in regards to this.
"I personally can't stand her." "I'd love to have that house". I can think of several teachings in the Bible that discourage these thoughts.
I am sick to death of these Joyce Myer bashing threads. It's one thing to expose false teaching, it's another entirely to GOSSIP.

Continue!
I can think of a few not so nice people that live in really nice houses. Just because I like the house doesn't mean I have to care for the person living in it, especially when the $$$'s for said house came in an questionable way (you know, blab and grab). Also it doesn't make it gossip to discuss things that they themselves write and say.

Post a picture of her house, I would love to see it (I've already seen jan & paul's and benny's).

[SilverLHS]

1. "I personally can't stand her" is a very unChristlike thing to say.
2. "I'd love to have that house", is coveting.
3. When not exposing false teaching but instead talking about weird behavior IS GOSSIP.
:wave

[CountryPerson]

Dianne, I'm glad that you are still reading the posts here at RR. What you've been told by Becky and the others is absolutely right. I really admire your desire to learn of God and His will for your life. There are many fine teachers who can help you with this. One of my favorite teachers is Dr. John MacArthur. He has a daily radio program called Grace to You, where he does verse-by-verse teaching of God's Word. The website for broadcast information is www.gty.org. My husband & I have listened to him, read his books, and have grown so much in our understanding of God's Word as a result of his faithful teaching. There is also a website that you may want to check out: www.biblebb.org where you can find written transcripts of Biblically solid sermons and also a section of Questions and Answers where you can read how God's Word is used to respond to ques. on a variety of issues. Blessings to you, Dianne.
~Lynn

[sandy111]

Diane, what Joyce does is mix truth with untruths.

wof is NOT the true gospel. it is opposite to the truth.
and Joyce is into it.

throw away all books tapes ect, and read your bible.
if you must have a tape get the ones that are only going thru reading the bible.

Joyce is like haggee. they teach like they are authoritarians and to some of us we like that. but that does'nt make a good bible teacher.

shes gotten rich off the backs of the poor and their donations,
that is not like Christ. telling people Jesus went to hell, is not scriptural.

the book of James has lots to say about the rich.....and how to look at wealth.

what Grace and Becky have said to you is the truth.
I think you know that, and I know its hard letting go, but
you must put Jesus first. not you or them.

[sandy111]

Yes, Iam very active in my church and with other believers. Yes I also have dinner on the grounds and yes there will be various opinions from different christians and like me there are some christians who like Joyce Meyers and learn a lot from her, but I plan to talk with my pastor, and get help in this area and move on from there.

does Joyces teaching line up with scripture? nope.
says a lot right there.

so what does one learn from her then?

[SeaDreamer]

Dianne,

This may simply be an aswer from God that you were not expecting. Since you have truly been seeking God's guidance then surely your running across this thread is not accident. I remember when I found out some of my favorite teachers weren't lining up with God's Word. I was devastated and went through several months of doubt and discouragement and considered just giving up. However, I came out on the other side more grounded in my trust in God and with a lot more biblical knowledge than I ever had before. There is a fine line we believers walk between learning from others but holding their words up to the light of Scripture and it's not an easy thing to do. And sometimes God pushes us out of our comfort zone in order to further our walk....that's never fun but always worth it because it builds our faith. :):

[OscarTheOnion]

Hi,
I am so suprised that there is negative talk about her. I have read her books and listened to her tapes and every morning to her sermons on the internet.
I have been so distressed and having problems with my faith. She has helped me a great deal to grow in my faith and I really felt God was speaking to me through her. I think she is awesome. I felt like she was down to earth and has really reached me to grow in Christ. So it was so disappointing to here that people don't like her and feel that there is something fishy about her taxes. Help me. I have trusted the Lord to teach me through her. I feel like crying.

My sister, I used to be a huge fan of Joyce Meyers. She is a wonderful speaker, exceptionally convincing. She is very blessed in her talent and especially uplifting to women.

The people in this thread speak the truth. We are living in an age of deception and it is critical to not let ourselves be led by false prophets.

Jesus needs no mediator nor translator. Question everything.

[Becky]

Could everyone please stop focusing on feelings about Joyce and instead focus on the facts about Joyce? Like the ones I posted? :sigh

Diane, keep the faith. :thumb God is always true and just. God is good all the time. I tell you what helps me; a good study bible. There are a lot of good men and women of God out there that have sound teaching from the Word. Take your study bible and meditate on the Word. God will show you what's true and what is not true. :hug

Thanks Oscar. :thumb Good post.

[Jeanie]

Let me say up front, I do not watch Joyce regularly. I bought a couple of her books, began reading them and didn't find them interesting enough to finish.
I did catch her online teaching titled, 'Freedom is Not Free'. It was a blessing for me and those around me. Mainly in pointing out my crying, screaming flesh always wanting it's way and pouting and manipulating emotions. It wasn't exactly a Word study, but it was very helpful in my personal life.

What I want to ask :
.. is it possible for a teacher to have a flawed view in one area and still teach solid life giving concepts in another?
Or is it that any portion of leaven in a teacher's life ruins the whole lump?

If the latter is the case, I had better resign from my positions in the church body. I certainly do NOT want to be leading others astray, and I'm certain there are things God wants me to do differently as I grow.

(Just so we don't get the wrong idea, I am well aware of WOF. It's a teaching centered around selfishness, IMHO.)

[Becky]

I don't think it matters too much on nonessential issues like whether your paster is pre post trib in belief of the end times.

What does matter is core teaching. Joyce thinks she is sinfree, she is above reproach, Jesus was the first board again man, and the cross wasn't enough, that Jesus redemmed us in hell. :freaked

So yes, it makes a difference in what they are teaching. We all make mistakes but these are huge mistakes.

[Christine]

I am glad to see that they are holding her accountable. Secular councelors don't get tax breaks and neither should Joyce as that is all she does, IMO -- she acts as a professional counselor

[Christine]

Post a picture of her house, I would love to see it (I've already seen jan & paul's and benny's). It is more of a compound as she also houses her children and their families on the property.

It is really beautiful!

This photo is from the St Louis Post -- back when it was originally posted here.

[markofthebest]

1. "I personally can't stand her" is a very unChristlike thing to say.
2. "I'd love to have that house", is coveting.
3. When not exposing false teaching but instead talking about weird behavior IS GOSSIP.
:wave


1. Truth hurts, but the poster was being honest. I can't stand the blab and grab crowd either.

2. Most of us have said something similar and all we meant was that we would like a home, a car, an outfit "like" that...

3. When you put your face on TV, you act inappropriately for a 'Christian" minister, and sell the WOF false gospel, you open yourself up for public scrutiny. Don't like it, can't handle it, then don't do it.

I have very little sympathy for this crowd of snake oil salesmen cum false prophets.

[markofthebest]

It is more of a compound as she also houses her children and their families on the property.

It is really beautiful!

This photo is from the St Louis Post -- back when it was originally posted here.


Oh, compound is definately the word. That is some estate. Thanks!

[ohappyday]

What concerns me about this news is this. When did the church have to start paying tax on donations. Was this area part of the business she is in, are part of the ministry. I know Joyce is very wealthy, totally apart from the church. Just wondering if the IRS has changed the tax exempt for churches. Are is this a state thing. I know they tax all monies.

[Diane 1611]

Joyce is not a minister in a church where she would be preaching every Sunday, but a speaker and an author. Since she makes beaucoup bucks off of her books and off of her personal appearances and conferences, then yes, I believe she should pay taxes. If I were a bestselling author (hopefully someday), I would be happy to pay taxes. After all, Jesus said, "Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's." Matt. 22:21b

[sandy111]

could you see paul or Jesus making money off helping people?

I cant.

[ub4war]

could you see paul or Jesus making money off helping people?

I cant.

thay says it all bout jm:thumb

[4everHis]

Great thread, when you read it all the way through, it really brings home the truth.
The bottom line is that we all must read our Bible. Becky, you are 100 percent correct that each of us needs a study bible in order to properly understand the word of God. I remember when I was first saved, the hunger I had to read the bible and discover God and His amazing grace and love.

In our modern electronic age, it is too easy to turn on a tv, radio or tape and let someone else preach and teach us. I have done it myself until I finally realized that what I was hearing was not what I had read in Gods word.
so, over the past several years, I've mostly quit listening to the tv/radio preachers and teachers and have gone back to reading the word for myself.

Becky, thanks for your very appropriate posts in this thread. They are spot on and filled with truth that even a blind man can see.

My heart and prayers go out to all of us to find the truth and hold it near and dear to our hearts. Do NOT let the devil come in and steal your joy and your freedom.

[busterdog]

Joyce is not a minister in a church where she would be preaching every Sunday, but a speaker and an author. Since she makes beaucoup bucks off of her books and off of her personal appearances and conferences, then yes, I believe she should pay taxes. If I were a bestselling author (hopefully someday), I would be happy to pay taxes. After all, Jesus said, "Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's." Matt. 22:21b

What an intelligent observation! Thus, she is not necessarily reaching into the plate for that mercedes!

Her teaching is fine. Not perfect, but fine. She does qualify alot of that prosperity teaching stuff, but she will never get credit for it in certain quarters. Its been a while since I took time to listen. I don't know about her character. I do hope she is a lot nicer than she seemed in the Target.

[humbleone]

STOP!
Think about what you're saying and how you're saying it before you do another post in regards to this.
"I personally can't stand her." "I'd love to have that house". I can think of several teachings in the Bible that discourage these thoughts.
I am sick to death of these Joyce Myer bashing threads. It's one thing to expose false teaching, it's another entirely to GOSSIP.
__________________


*RIGHT ON!*

I'm so tired of these threads. I personally have been blessed by many of Joyce Meyer's books and teaching tapes. I KNOW God has led me to some if not most of them. So helpful, so timely.

Are there any dates on these alleged quotes of hers? I understand that she recanted some statements she once had made... and I believe she originally made the statements like, 15 YEARS ago.

Pick a teaching of hers that is not Biblical, and post the teaching here and then dispute it with the Word of Word. Stop saying, "Well she believes this and that and said this and that."

In a weird way, its almost encouraging that so many seem to dislike Ms. Meyer. The Bible says when all men speak well of you, that something is wrong. The woman is no people-pleaser, that's for sure!

God bless and Diane, dont lose heart. Jesus isnt in the business of "tricking" people or leading them astray. Ask Him Yourself about the books and tapes youre reading and learning from. Fast if you want to, too. That has helped me get some solid answers to heartrending prayers before....

Peace be with you,


humbleone

[The Bearen]

I have heard Joyce meyer a few times recently and too me she sounds more like a motavationable speaker , she is very articulate and funny .
But no real solid meat, she knows how to pick on topics that will tickle peoples ears.

Has she ever covered things like Bible Prophesy and preparing for the end times in her teachings?
Or is she Kingdom Now replacment theology type?

Dave

[Dianne]

Dear Humbleone,
Thank you for your uplifting message. I have been very blessed by Joyce Meyer's books and tapes and will continue to listen to her message. So my heart has been lifted up again. Dianne

[humbleone]

I have heard Joyce meyer a few times recently and too me she sounds more like a motavationable speaker , she is very articulate and funny .
But no real solid meat, she knows how to pick on topics that will tickle peoples ears.


Actually, my ears have not been tickled by any of the teaching tapes of Joyce's that I have listened to! Many are very honest, brutally so at times I mean. I have cringed as I recognized myself in things she was saying.... and other times laughed in embarrassment. I think Joyce has a good way of infusing a little humor SOMEtimes, because otherwise, I think a person might feel so messed-up and that they cant do a single thing right so why bother anyway kind of thing.... at least I have had a tendency to go that way in my own life and walk.

I really recommend a book of hers called, "Battlefield of the Mind." It is VERY good, very helpful, and chock full of related Scriptures. I could not find one un-Biblical thing in that book and have reread it several times. She knows what she's talking about, esp with personal problems and struggles kind of stuff, because she herself had a very troubled life... she lived it, so she does seem to understand on a gut level. WHich is always refreshing.

Someone on here asked if was possible to be "off" in 1 area and "on in others. I think the answer is a resounding YES! One of my pastors is a holy and extremely sincere Christian, but I just disagree with her 100% on a few issues. I really do think she is "off" in these areas.... but 85% else of what she teaches and believes is, in my own opinion, right-on. I can't knock her off or dismiss EVERYTHING she has to say just because I do happen to disagree with her so strongly in a few other (non-salvation related) issues, u know? NOt that I havent had struggles though.

I just think it is not only a mistake but also kind of foolish to completely write off a teacher of the Word of God because you disagree with one or more areas of their teachings. Dont throw out the baby with the bathwater, u know? Who here is perfect? Attack the teachings then, not the individual. JOyce Meyer really HAS done an awful lot for the Kingdom of God, and I think it stinks that people trash the woman the way they do. She's written like 40 books or something and countless teaching tapes. She travels all over the world, teaching, praying, ministering, etc. I know JM Ministries definitely does missions outreaches. It is a world-wide ministry, not just confined to the US.

***************************
Has she ever covered things like Bible Prophesy and preparing for the end times in her teachings?
Or is she Kingdom Now replacment theology type?
*******************************
No idea if she is Kingdom Now or not, either way. BUt because she doesnt preach on (that I know of, I could be wrong here), end times does not disqualify her, u know? I wish my own pastors would teach on the end times a lot more, and prophecy, but they do not. Are they bad pastors? Absolutely not! I need to believe that they DO seek the Lord and simply share messages they are led by the Holy Spirit of God to preach to our congregation. I dont know everything....I hardly know anything! I try to remind myself of that when I do start to feel bothered by the lack of end times teaching in my own church. Also, there are a lot of ministries out there that "specialize" in certain areas.... so I seek those out (online mostly) to read and learn, etc. I am not so sure that one church, or one pastor, or one teacher, can possibly meet all of the needs of an individual believer... nor are they meant to.

Just my 2 cents.


Peace be with you,


humbleone

[Selah]

Someone on here asked if was possible to be "off" in 1 area and "on in others. I think the answer is a resounding YES! One of my pastors is a holy and extremely sincere Christian, but I just disagree with her 100% on a few issues. I really do think she is "off" in these areas.... but 85% else of what she teaches and believes is, in my own opinion, right-on. I can't knock her off or dismiss EVERYTHING she has to say just because I do happen to disagree with her so strongly in a few other (non-salvation related) issues, u know? NOt that I havent had struggles though.

I just think it is not only a mistake but also kind of foolish to completely write off a teacher of the Word of God because you disagree with one or more areas of their teachings. Dont throw out the baby with the bathwater, u know? Who here is perfect? Attack the teachings then, not the individual. JOyce Meyer really HAS done an awful lot for the Kingdom of God, and I think it stinks that people trash the woman the way they do. She's written like 40 books or something and countless teaching tapes. She travels all over the world, teaching, praying, ministering, etc. I know JM Ministries definitely does missions outreaches. It is a world-wide ministry, not just confined to the US.


The difference is whether you are disagreeing over essentials or non-essentials of the Christian faith.

Joyce teaches that Christ went to hell when He died, and wrestled with satan for the "keys" to control the earth. This is heresy. Satan never controlled the earth. God has always been in control.

If this is a debate over end-times views, or whether they have pews or chairs in their building--these are non-essentials. We can debate them, but we should not divide over them.

But doctrine--we divide over.

This is why Paul publically denounced false teachers, and this is why Christ taught on leaven.


5 Now when His disciples had come to the other side, they had forgotten to take bread. 6 Then Jesus said to them, “Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and the Sadducees.”
7 And they reasoned among themselves, saying, “It is because we have taken no bread.”
8 But Jesus, being aware of it, said to them, “O you of little faith, why do you reason among yourselves because you have brought no bread? 9 Do you not yet understand, or remember the five loaves of the five thousand and how many baskets you took up? 10 Nor the seven loaves of the four thousand and how many large baskets you took up? 11 How is it you do not understand that I did not speak to you concerning bread?—but to beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees.” 12 Then they understood that He did not tell them to beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and Sadducees. (Matthew 16)

1 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and such sexual immorality as is not even named among the Gentiles—that a man has his father’s wife! 2 And you are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he who has done this deed might be taken away from among you. 3 For I indeed, as absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged (as though I were present) him who has so done this deed. 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together, along with my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
6 Your glorying is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump? 7 Therefore purge out the old leaven, that you may be a new lump, since you truly are unleavened. For indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us. 8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. (1 Corinthians 5)

7 You ran well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth? 8 This persuasion does not come from Him who calls you. 9 A little leaven leavens the whole lump. (Galatians 5)

[Elizabeth_S]

When I see these threads and see people defending teachings that are anti bilbical or just plain false teachings, I think of something a very wise poster asked one time concerning teachings by these WOF "ministers"

If you hear a speaker or minister preaching and something is not right, weather you heard it or it is shown to be true and you say you receive bl;essings in their words, even though they have been shown to be false or misleading:

"how much sewage are you willing to tolerate in your water before you stop drinking it?" (paraphrased) Is it one drop you are willing to tolerate or does it take a cup full, before you stop drinking from that cup?

Just something to ponder.

Not one person has told a single lie about Joyce Meyer in this thread in stating the facts on her teachings, they have told the straight up truth as backed by facts. If one continues to defend it after being shown the wolf in sheep's clothing, that is up to the one defending it, just know that those here who don't want any sewage in their drinking water are just trying to let you know the water is dirty.

If one continues to drink the tainted water, that is on them.

[monavale]

Dear Humbleone,
Thank you for your uplifting message. I have been very blessed by Joyce Meyer's books and tapes and will continue to listen to her message. So my heart has been lifted up again. Dianne
And I hope you continue to be blessed.

[ImgoingUp]

The bible says to test the spirits........thats as important and as much our responsibility as a christian to do as to read your bible or to pray or meditate. It is God's mandate for us to be discerning and the rightly divide the word of God. We must be as diligent and as mature in these areas as in any other area of our walk with God. Dont have the verse but it also says that you have no need of a teacher for the Holy Spirit will teach you. Dont be deceived brethren......... God is very able to talk to you and me and tell us not this way, not right or left , but keep your eyes on ME !! God is well able to teach you what you need to know by HIS SPIRIT !!

I say this with humility having come through a LOT of wrong teaching and wrong direction over 30 plus years of walking with God.

Listen to God and have no others before Him .....and he will send you the teachers that you need.