open marriges

[col311]

I know people who claim to be folowers of God yet they engadge in orgies. They say that if both partners of the marrige are aware, and okay with sleeping with other people outside the marrage that its not really cheating.

[Hootmon]

I know people who claim to be folowers of God yet they engadge in orgies. They say that if both partners of the marrige are aware, and okay with sleeping with other people outside the marrage that its not really cheating. They are now 'one flesh' with everyone they were with, and everyone that all of them were with previously. Ugh...

Reconcile THAT to Scripture...

[col311]

They are now 'one flesh' with everyone they were with, and everyone that all of them were with previously. Ugh...

Reconcile THAT to Scripture...


They use 1 john 2:1 and 1 John 3:9 There are a few others but, they like to take parts of the Bible to promote thier lifestyile.

[carmen]

Perhaps they need to refresh themselves on the meaning of adultery. Or even look at what Christ says about looking at others with lust :(:.

[col311]

Perhaps they need to refresh themselves on the meaning of adultery. Or even look at what Christ says about looking at others with lust :(:.


Read the third post of this thread, perhaps this will help. Not that I'm defending them, but I thought I would be unbias as possible.

[carmen]

Oops! We posted at the same time on that one :laughRead the third post of this thread, perhaps this will help. Not that I'm defending them, but I thought I would be unbias as possible.1 John 2:1 My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.

1 John 3:9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.

Sounds to me like what they are saying is that they can't sin as Christians; therefore, what they are doing isn't wrong. It would be wrong for a non-believer, but not a believer because of these verses. This is flat-out wrong.

Tell them to go back a chapter: 1 John 1:5-10
5 This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.
6 If we claim to have fellowship with him yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live by the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.
8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives.

[Hootmon]

They use 1 john 2:1 and 1 John 3:9 There are a few others but, they like to take parts of the Bible to promote thier lifestyile.:wacko

Id hate to see how they interpret the 'Love thy neighbor' verse...

Lets put that 1 John 2:1 verse in context... If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.

My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world. By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments.

The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.
(1Jo 1:8 thru 1Jo 2:6)

[Hootmon]

Tell them to go back a chapter: 1 John 1:5-10 Echo? :heh

[carmen]

:lol

[col311]

Oops! We posted at the same time on that one :laugh1 John 2:1 My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.

1 John 3:9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.

Sounds to me like what they are saying is that they can't sin as Christians; therefore, what they are doing isn't wrong. It would be wrong for a non-believer, but not a believer because of these verses. This is flat-out wrong.

Tell them to go back a chapter: 1 John 1:5-10
5 This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.
6 If we claim to have fellowship with him yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live by the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.
8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives.


This is good enough for me, however they are caught up in thier particular desire, so they are eager to hear scripture that appeals or at least think that appeals to them, and are deaf and stubborn to the other scriptures.

Just curious

Are there other scriptures that I could use.

[carmen]

This is good enough for me, however they are caught up in thier particular desire, so they are eager to hear scripture that appeals or at least think that appeals to them, and are deaf and stubborn to the other scriptures.

Just curious

Are there other scriptures that I could use.Other scriptures to disprove being sinless as a Christian, or to show that adultery is wrong?

[col311]

Other scriptures to disprove being sinless as a Christian, or to show that adultery is wrong?


Right, scriptures that disprove that a child of God can't sin or at least that they can do whatever they want and not have to worry.

Thank you.

[carmen]

Romans 7 is clear about the battle that goes on between the flesh and our spirit once we are saved. There is no need for a battle if we are held "sinless" after salvation.

Galations 5:17 addresses the same thing.


I am not sure that if these people will not hear the total and complete refutation of their stand as stated in 1 John 1, they aren't likely to hear these verses, either though :(:

[Hootmon]

God repremands those who are His children, up to and including 'premature' death.

If they are sinning completely without consequence, and without any 'guilty conscience', it is unlikely they are actually saved.

[Kyrie Eleison]

God repremands those who are His children, up to and including 'premature' death.

If they are sinning completely without consequence, and without any 'guilty conscience', it is unlikely they are actually saved.


Yes, a believer will be chastised by God, even unto premature death. When the Holy Spirit lives within a person, sin is very uncomfortable and cannot be maintained as a lifestyle without guilt or eventual death. Salvation is found only in being born again of the Spirit through belief that Jesus payed the price for all sin, once & for all. Even a new Christian cannot live a life of sin without guilt and reprimand, and a born again believer will hunger to know God's Word better. That doesn't mean searching it like a legal document, looking for loopholes, or ways to reinterpret the meaning of a verse outside of the whole meaning of the Bible. They can't possibly back up their misinterpretation of those verses by using other Scripture in context. Jesus made it clear that lust/adultery were sins to repent of and steer clear of after being forgiven.

[col311]

Romans 7 is clear about the battle that goes on between the flesh and our spirit once we are saved. There is no need for a battle if we are held "sinless" after salvation.

Galations 5:17 addresses the same thing.


I am not sure that if these people will not hear the total and complete refutation of their stand as stated in 1 John 1, they aren't likely to hear these verses, either though :(:


thank you for your help. Whether they receive them or not, I still appreciate the infor.


God Bless :):

[TonyLee]

I am not sure that if these people will not hear the total and complete refutation of their stand as stated in 1 John 1, they aren't likely to hear these verses, either though :(:

If it interrupts their lifestyle, then I doubt they will hear it. Just use the parts you like, or twist something to make it fit what you want to do, or throw out the parts that do not agree with how you want to live, and you have the perfect "bible" for you. This is the philosophy of many people.

[BHiles]

Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

[col311]

God repremands those who are His children, up to and including 'premature' death.

If they are sinning completely without consequence, and without any 'guilty conscience', it is unlikely they are actually saved.


This is just a little bit easier said than done, being that they have a Bible teacher that supports thier life style.

[carmen]

This is just a little bit easier said than done, being that they have a Bible teacher that supports thier life style.:faint

Does the pastor at the church they're attending also support it?

[col311]

:faint

Does the pastor at the church they're attending also support it?


Okay are you ready for this?

They're not in an official church, they're all illegaly residing in an apartment. They've given the Bible Teacher complete Athority over them. So he is unoffically a pastor, He likes to be called a bishop, and a reverend as well. :laugh but he isn't a licensed minister. They give him money to help pay the rent and other things and He receives it as a tythe.

This would really be a laughing matter if I didn't Genually love some of the people in that apartment, and as strange as this may sound, I believe that at least some of them have sincerly accepted Christ as thier personal Savior.

BTW

The teacher of this group is the same teacher in the Red flag thread that I posted.

[Hootmon]

A Cult then... Sounds like bad news...

[wsbsteven]

Major red flag on that one. Sounds like a major FP.

[Chris4Christ]

A Cult then... Sounds like bad news...
Definitely a cult. No wonder their doctrine is so messed up. :tsk

Col, I doubt these friends of yours will receive very much of what you have to say to them until they are out of their cult. I think that's probably where you need to focus your efforts/attention.

[carmen]

A Cult then... Sounds like bad news...:sad

[Whosoever]

Yes, definitely sounds like a cult. :sad

[Porkchop]

Not to side track the thread but Hoot I like your change of Avatars everyonce in a while...kind of like a new hairdo!

Back to the thread...strange ducks.:nod

[Maria]

I know people who claim to be folowers of God yet they engadge in orgies. They say that if both partners of the marrige are aware, and okay with sleeping with other people outside the marrage that its not really cheating.

That doesn't make any sense! They are doing other things like adultery. They are married yet sleeping with other people! What kind of non sense is that!

I am more and more disgusted with what is happening in the world today. There seems to be a veil of deceit falling on people for a long time now.... There is no right or reason.... Everything is twisted... No one feels (well not everyone) outraged at injustice and human suffering...

I don't know what else to say...

It is very sad...:freaked :(:

[StarVoyager]

Yes, a believer will be chastised by God, even unto premature death. When the Holy Spirit lives within a person, sin is very uncomfortable and cannot be maintained as a lifestyle without guilt or eventual death. Salvation is found only in being born again of the Spirit through belief that Jesus payed the price for all sin, once & for all. Even a new Christian cannot live a life of sin without guilt and reprimand, and a born again believer will hunger to know God's Word better. That doesn't mean searching it like a legal document, looking for loopholes, or ways to reinterpret the meaning of a verse outside of the whole meaning of the Bible. They can't possibly back up their misinterpretation of those verses by using other Scripture in context. Jesus made it clear that lust/adultery were sins to repent of and steer clear of after being forgiven.

I have looked at the website of an organized group who have a name for this lifestyle and their organization, and they have done exactly what Kyrie has described above.... they have searched, twisted, manipulated and then totally misinterpreted The Word of God to rationalize their desire to engage in straight, gay, and lesbian sexual encounters (including orgies) outside of marriage.

Looks to me like they are simply looking for "fire insurance".

Peace - Patrick ><>

[Rev21]

Looks to me like they are simply looking for "fire insurance".


They better be investing in asbestos underwear...

[Been_Ready]

:wacko
Id hate to see how they interpret the 'Love thy neighbor' verse...


Hootmom, this makes me laugh. They have interpreted the 'Love thy neighbor' verse, they are loving everyone and more :lol

My oh my, come Lord Jesus, come quick.

[Jacob]

I know people who claim to be folowers of God yet they engadge in orgies. They say that if both partners of the marrige are aware, and okay with sleeping with other people outside the marrage that its not really cheating.


Maybe they do not feel they are cheating on each other, but they are still sinning against God. He established how sex is to be used irregardless of how the couple feels about it.


"But because of immoralities, each man is to have his own wife, and each woman is to have her own husband. The husband must fulfill his duty to his wife, and likewise also the wife to her husband." (1 Cor 7:2)

"Now these things became our examples, to the intent that we should not lust after evil things as they also lusted. And do not become idolaters as were some of them. As it is written, “The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.” Nor let us commit sexual immorality, as some of them did, and in one day twenty-three thousand fell;"

"Marriage is to be held in honor among all, and the marriage bed is to be undefiled; for fornicators and adulterers God will judge." (Hebrews 13)

[StarVoyager]

Maybe they do not feel they are cheating on each other, but they are still sinning against God. He established how sex is to be used irregardless of how the couple feels about it.


"But because of immoralities, each man is to have his own wife, and each woman is to have her own husband. The husband must fulfill his duty to his wife, and likewise also the wife to her husband." (1 Cor 7:2)

"Now these things became our examples, to the intent that we should not lust after evil things as they also lusted. And do not become idolaters as were some of them. As it is written, “The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.” Nor let us commit sexual immorality, as some of them did, and in one day twenty-three thousand fell;"

"Marriage is to be held in honor among all, and the marriage bed is to be undefiled; for fornicators and adulterers God will judge." (Hebrews 13)

I believe Jacob has summed it up. Well said.

Peace - Patrick ><>

[countmeworthy]

Hootmom, this makes me laugh. They have interpreted the 'Love thy neighbor' verse, they are loving everyone and more :lol

More like LUSTING EVERYONE

I had a co-worker who was living with his girlfriend when we first met. Oh how he praised her & praised her but would become adamant at my suggestion that they marry.

Months went by & one night after work, he 'fessed up to me and told me in PRIVATE he & his girlfriend were swingers. While he was telling me, he was EXTREMELY EMBARRASSED & FELT ASHAMED from my perspective.

I was totally shocked as I'd never heard of swingers, much less 'know' one. He tried to explain how in the circle of swingers, no drugs or alcohol are allowed & if a person does not want to engage in sex with the person who suggests it, the person turned down respectfully backs off.

He really tried to convince me of how 'healthy' it was not to cheat..yaddy, yaddy, yaddy.

But what stayed with me was the expression of embarrassment & shame that was on his face as he was telling me. He was also BEGGING ME NOT to HATE HIM !!! I told him I would NEVER hate him as much as I disagreed with his views.

Some more months passed by & lo & behold he & his girlfriend got married !!!
They had stopped being swingers. AWWW, but not really, they labeled themselves as 'polyamourists' or something like that.

This cult/club embraced a 'deeper' 'emotional' level with the partners they shared.

He told me there were a lot of 'Christians', even some pastors in this movement.

Tsk...tsk... :tsk :tsk Ubelievable !! :doh
I haven't talked to my friend in a while. I used to pray for him & his wife but haven't in some time. I've been reminded to pray for them reading this thread.

[Been_Ready]

You know as I read this again its amazing, I was speaking to a friend the other day about the living situation that he is in right now. He is seeking God, and had been seeking him for some years now.

The other day when we were talking about all of this, he told me that he prayed to God and asked God if he should get into the situation he is in. That means move in with his woman and have an adulterous affair, he told me that the Lord said yes to him. I wanted to bust out laughing, but out of respect and I was getting pretty upset too, I didn't say anything. He said according to the law they are married 'common-law marriage'.

This is just to show you how people today have used God for a mockery, why would God tell someone to shack up when he speaks against that in his word.
God is getting blamed for everything these days, from killing my wife to fooling around with the neighbor.

We live in a troubling world today, everyday I wonder why the catching up is taking so long. :cry

[countmeworthy]

P.S... I forgot to comment more on my observation. If indeed he was embarrassed, ashamed to tell me but felt he wanted/needed to, perhaps his consience was & hopefully IS bothering him. That in itself is a good thing. But it will only be a REAL GOOD thing, if he comes to repentence & repudiates that lifestyle.

[col311]

This is just to show you how people today have used God for a mockery, why would God tell someone to shack up when he speaks against that in his word.
. :cry


:sad :yell :Cry :pray