Married Men

[BHiles]

I truly believe that the problem with marriages among believers needs to be squarely placed to a large extent on men. We are given so much by God and we abuse and are unthankful for what He has given.

God gave us leadership roles in the home, yet so many times we see it as a ruler instead of servant. Many things would work so much better for us if our wives truly understood our love for them. How does a wife understand love?

The same way we understand God's love for us.

Sacrifice. It has become such a dirty word in the realm of the "abundant life" but we are explicitly told our life is to be one of sacrifice. I doubt that there would ever be a woman to ever leave a man if she truly felt loved and he sacrificed for her to show her that love. I am sure that there are some women with a psychological problems that this would not be true however the vast majority I believe would never dream of such a thing. We need to be thinking constantly of her needs and her stresses, how we can make her life easier and fulfilling, getting the focus off of ourselves. Looking ahead for things that help her outlook on life and consistantly drawing and encouraging her relationship with God. We many times fail to see her as a sister in Christ -a co-heir of heaven, a co-laborer on earth. Teaching the children to honor and respect and give to her so that her self-worth is found in her God and her family and not in the praises of her job or her boss. We have been given an awesome charge. The fruit of what can happen when a woman is truly loved and knows it is immeasurable in its produce. Your children stability and confidence in right, turn into the might arrows in your expert hand to reach this world for the kingdoms sake. And you fulfill the example of Christ to a lost and dying world.

Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

Show her today.

[Kaz]

Yes and Amen!

And when the husband doesn't fulfill his role the wife rushes in to pick up the slack and ends up being the "head" she was never designed to be.

I am blessed with a Godly, loving husband whom I gladly submit to in the Lord Jesus Christ. :):

Thanks for your post.
Jesus bless,
Kaz

[babylonrising]

I disagree from a divorced male's standpoint.
Who is to blame when one person is faithful and one isn't? Who is to blame if one encourages Church and Christ and one does not?

[BHiles]

I disagree from a divorced male's standpoint.
Who is to blame when one person is faithful and one isn't? Who is to blame if one encourages Church and Christ and one does not?

I'm not here to heap any coals on you brother, just encourage those men who are currently married.

[PDuv]

Amen Brent!

I am currently enrolled in a 3 year course through Christ Quest Institute (Life Partners), a Christian organization that teaches the very same thing you are talking about.

Instead of me trying to say what they are about, here is a summary from their website: (www.lifepartners.org - be sure to type ORG not COM or else you will be in for a surprise! :B: )

The Christ-Quest Institute is the follow-up to the Discovery Seminar. It is a personal discipleship program wherein Christians are taught how to illustrate Christlikeness. All students must enter at the freshman level, then graduating to the sophomore, junior and senior levels. Classes consist of homework and lectures along with question and answer opportunities as well as accountability for application.

If married, both husband and wife are encouraged to participate. Because Christlikeness is the goal of Life Partners Christian Ministries, all Christians are welcome to submit an application for admission after attending the Discovery Seminar.

The personal application of The Christ-Quest Institute course work guarantees that a man will:

- Understand the mind of a woman as Christ would and as validated by his own wife

- Gain and enjoy the respect for his Christlikeness from every family member

- Be able to effectively resolve conflicts, past and present

- Motivate others to follow his leadership as they see him follow Christ


I am basically only 1 of 3 single men in the class (two are divorced, I was never married). The remainder are husbands and wifes. It is so interesting to see what 'Christian' married couples are going through. It also amazes me how much we men live in and act out in 'the flesh' rather than the spirit.

I cannot begin to tell you the clarity of teaching I have received! We study both Hebrew and Greek translations to learn about what it means to be more like Christ. They help you to first discover your Spiritual Gift, then learn about the Fruit of The Spirit, continuing on to our emotions and how we are connected to God through them, and so forth. I am only 9 months into the first year, but it has been an incredible journey so far.

The major things I have learned so far:

- The husband/man is the Spiritual Leader
- The wife/woman is to be a 'help meet' for her husband (help him to recognize his sin so that he turns to God for help to be more Christ-like)

Gen 2:18 KJV, "And the LORD God said, [It is] not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him."

- God is an emotional God who has blessed women with emotions (and has somewhat cursed men with being mechanical thinkers- I can't validate this last part, but that's what I was told was the translation from Hebrew of the verses that were studied)

- Men need to learn to 'understand' their wives - to learn about emotions - 'Feel' emotions so that he can relate to and understand his wife in a loving way.

1 Pet 3:7 NKJV, "Husbands, likewise, dwell with them with understanding, giving honor to the wfe, as to the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life, that your prayers may not be hindered.

There is a lot more to say, but I am joyfully overwhelmed to be learning (and hopefully growing) as a man as God had intended!

Thanks for talking about this subject. It needs to be brought to the forefront of many Christian men and women's walks :thumb

[babydane]

bhiles, pretty cool post. i'm not married, nor do i plan on it for at least a few years, but i want to learn young, so i dont mess things up like so many husbands do. very cool...

[Time2Sow]

Brent,

to borrow and twist a phrase from Barbar the elephant:

You have Godly ideas! You can wear my hat!
:wave

[cameron222]

BHiles, Adrian Rogers, my favorite preacher once said that iys not your loves that holds your marriage togethet, its you marriage that holds your love together. I liked that!

Marriage is about committment, but baby boomers, and others, have thrown committment out the window. Its now about "what makes ME happy"
and a spouse will divorce their partner over trivial items that would have been laughable 25 years ago.

[cameron222]

Sorry ....I don't edit.

Its not your love that holds your marriage together, its your marriage that holds your love together.

[Benja32one]

I truly believe that the problem with marriages among believers needs to be squarely placed to a large extent on men. We are given so much by God and we abuse and are unthankful for what He has given.

God gave us leadership roles in the home, yet so many times we see it as a ruler instead of servant. Many things would work so much better for us if our wives truly understood our love for them. How does a wife understand love?

The same way we understand God's love for us.

Sacrifice. It has become such a dirty word in the realm of the "abundant life" but we are explicitly told our life is to be one of sacrifice. I doubt that there would ever be a woman to ever leave a man if she truly felt loved and he sacrificed for her to show her that love. I am sure that there are some women with a psychological problems that this would not be true however the vast majority I believe would never dream of such a thing. We need to be thinking constantly of her needs and her stresses, how we can make her life easier and fulfilling, getting the focus off of ourselves. Looking ahead for things that help her outlook on life and consistantly drawing and encouraging her relationship with God. We many times fail to see her as a sister in Christ -a co-heir of heaven, a co-laborer on earth. Teaching the children to honor and respect and give to her so that her self-worth is found in her God and her family and not in the praises of her job or her boss. We have been given an awesome charge. The fruit of what can happen when a woman is truly loved and knows it is immeasurable in its produce. Your children stability and confidence in right, turn into the might arrows in your expert hand to reach this world for the kingdoms sake. And you fulfill the example of Christ to a lost and dying world.

Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

Show her today.
:wave
Just wondering, Bhiles....Did you post this from Jack Hyles?
:confused

[BHiles]

:wave
Just wondering, Bhiles....Did you post this from Jack Hyles?
:confused

No. I always give credit to the writer unless I write it.

[onsolidrock]

Marriage is a two way street. It's not just the husband's fault.

A lot of the problem is the lack of proper discipline in the homes over the last couple of generations. This breeds selfishness. It's pretty hard to get along with anyone else if you've been brought up to be selfish.

Another thing is the lack of commitment. In most states it is too easy to get a divorce. The mindset becomes "If it doesn't work out I can always get a divorce."

We need better teaching in churches about marriage.

[cameron222]

BHiles....when I was in high school I wrote a poem and my teacher asked if I had copied it. I felt a bit unappreciated. Guess she felt like I was not capable of such, but it was my own work.

[PDuv]

The number one issue I see within marriage is that MOST men (not all) do not want to be Christ-like. MOST (not all) want to follow and obey their own fleshly desires.

If a man was to follow after Christ daily, and die to his flesh, his communication and relationship with his wife would be... (I'm at a loss for words?!). Unfortunately, we are sinners and we will have to battle this on a daily basis for the remaninder of our physical lives.

I truly believe that a husband is 100% responsible (not 100% at fault!) for the spiritual condition of the marriage and family (Numbers 30 - role as a spiritual leader)

1 Peter 3:7 "Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with [them] according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered."

Responsible = Problem Solver
Fault = Problem Causer

I also believe that a wife will respond emotionally based upon how her husband tends to her spirit. She can't help but be affected by him emotionally: Gen 3:16 "....yet your desire shall be for your husband".

So, ultimately, I do believe as Brent stated in the first message that the man is ultimately responsible for the condition of his marriage and family. :nod

(BTW - just to give credit where credit is due ;): , all of these concepts I have learned are from Life Partners Christ Quest Institute)

[sandy111]

PDuv you hit the nail on the head.

the men follow fleshly desires. and it creates on big huge mess.

I'm glad some guys are finally getting it.
not to say theres a lot of bad wemon, but God put the man in first as head,
and to whom much is given much is required.....


and it makes a big difference with the whole family as to where the man is at in his role. I believe so much more than the woman.

[toddlemom]

What do you say to the Christian married man who won't forgive another member of the family (not me ...)

I'm afraid if I say more it will take the discussion too far off topic.

YSIC
Ann

[PDuv]

Hi Toddlemom: :):

Your question about forgiveness was just recently discussed on the board. If you do a search on Forgiveness, you should find the threads. Here are some that I found:

http://www.rr-bb.com/showthread.php?t=184057&highlight=forgiveness
http://www.rr-bb.com/showthread.php?t=155982&highlight=forgiveness
http://www.rr-bb.com/showthread.php?t=167053&highlight=forgiveness

My inital response is that forgiveness is talked about in the Lord's Prayer, ...."and forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us...". Basically, from what I learned from this and other verses that mention forgiveness (ie, Mark 11:25-26) is that if we will have ineffective prayer if we come to God with unforgiveness in our hearts.

I also think that it is a commandment from Jesus (see this thread started by Paul from the Admin team) http://www.rr-bb.com/showthread.php?t=178053&highlight=forgiveness

Hope this helps....

[Morningstarlet]

I truly believe that the problem with marriages among believers needs to be squarely placed to a large extent on men. We are given so much by God and we abuse and are unthankful for what He has given.

God gave us leadership roles in the home, yet so many times we see it as a ruler instead of servant. Many things would work so much better for us if our wives truly understood our love for them. How does a wife understand love?

The same way we understand God's love for us.

Sacrifice. It has become such a dirty word in the realm of the "abundant life" but we are explicitly told our life is to be one of sacrifice. I doubt that there would ever be a woman to ever leave a man if she truly felt loved and he sacrificed for her to show her that love. I am sure that there are some women with a psychological problems that this would not be true however the vast majority I believe would never dream of such a thing. We need to be thinking constantly of her needs and her stresses, how we can make her life easier and fulfilling, getting the focus off of ourselves. Looking ahead for things that help her outlook on life and consistantly drawing and encouraging her relationship with God. We many times fail to see her as a sister in Christ -a co-heir of heaven, a co-laborer on earth. Teaching the children to honor and respect and give to her so that her self-worth is found in her God and her family and not in the praises of her job or her boss. We have been given an awesome charge. The fruit of what can happen when a woman is truly loved and knows it is immeasurable in its produce. Your children stability and confidence in right, turn into the might arrows in your expert hand to reach this world for the kingdoms sake. And you fulfill the example of Christ to a lost and dying world.

Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

Show her today.

There's a ton of wisdom in your words. On the topic of leadership: I believe that the majority of Christian women do not want to be the spiritual leader of their home. They desperately want a man to look up to and "lead" the household. But unfortunately many women are thrown into that position because there is no one else to do it. I have several friends that were saved after they were married. Today they are struggling to raise Godly children with a man that is going against everything they are trying to instill in their children. The frustration these women feel is unreal. :(:

[bluebone]

I disagree that men are primarily to blame for relationships failing. I mean, how do you communicate the importance of a family issue... get on the same page... with someone who just refuses to "get it". When speaking in the simplest terms to your spouse still results in a a communication breakdown. No, the problem is on both people's shoulders. The man can only take so much blame if the woman won't work with him to come to some common ground. THAT'S what I've seen in my failed and really all of the relationships I've been exposed to.

In fact, I would say that the reason more relationships are failing is because the whole premise of relationships has changed. People go into relationships asking "what can I get out of it" rather than "what can I contribute"? If you have one person contributing and the other is not holding up their end or even the least bit interested in holding up their end, what CAN you do?

The problem is not as black and white as some of you are making it. I now know this first hand.

[AlishaGail]

I agree that it is often a combination of BOTH partners ultimately ending a marriage, but someone has to take the lead, and God has ordained men to do so. If we get into the whole "women do this, men do that, blah blah blah" we get dangerously close to accepting that age-old problem of believing that 2 wrongs make a right.

I don't see Bhiles trying to place all blame on men, but justly and rightfully posting about mens' duties in a marriage. It's a fact often overlooked today--along with the wives' roles. If we all (both genders) were to strive earnestly in our own responsibilities, it would be a lot easier. I believe that if both genders honestly take on the roles God intended, it wouldn't be easy. There would be a lot of questioning and a lot of agonizing and a lot of prayer over decisions and actions to take in different circumstances. However, that's a lot better than to be agonizing and hurt over a divorce.

The truth is, that as a leader, it is the man's responsibility. If the woman still sleeps around, is an unbeliever, etc, then there isn't anything to do and the responsibility is absolved. Just as a woman in an abusive relationship is not sinning by leaving the marriage. But ultimately, someone has to come in and draw the lines, and we're lucky that God did it a long time ago.

If we followed God's ultimate wish for marriage, it wouldn't be so hard. God wants us to be happy, and He never intended a slave/master relationship on either gender. The true partnership will occur with people who are already walking in the same direction. In that ideal relationship, a leader is the one who is hopefully stronger, who can support the other and his family in times of hardship with his physical presence and love, his financial support, and Godly morals and ethics and teachings. Hopefully the wife will be just as strong, truly completely him and becoming one with him so it's not strife.

Strife will occur when this ideal isn't met, and it's too often not found. Even for people who do fit together like this, worldly stress and pressures invade, and threaten the marriage. That's where it comes in handy that God has already announced who has to take over--the man.

I don't envy men. I don't envy my husband because I'm about as stubborn as they come. But I pray for him to remain strong over my stubborness when I'm wrong--Just as I pray to be an example and give him strength. Marriage is a circle, with the spouses making a whole, and God binding them together and holding them together.

It is so easy in a post like this to take it personally. I know I have that problem with certain subjects that hurt me. But it's NOT personal. It doesn't make anyone less than a man if their marriage doesn't survive and they followed Godly principles. God gave us free will in accepting Him... Don't you think that human's natural will is even weaker in accepting marriage and staying true? But in the end, you still have to admit that this is God's vision and choice for us.

Lisha

[Kaz]

A woman needs to marry a man who loves Jesus above all else (even her). :thumb

[BHiles]

The danger that married men and women get into is always looking at the other's responsibility and our own benefit. This is a great danger. The man will look at her responsibility of submission and claim she is not doing her part. The woman will look at his responsibility of loving her and claim he is not doing his part. We each need to look to our own responsiblity and our partner's benefit from the performance of that responsibility.

when Paul was writing He did not say "Husbands, Make sure your wives are in submission" nor "Wives, Make sure you tell you Husband to love you". No he addressed the responsiblities of each to the responsible party.

In doing so and looking forward to seeing the result of their benefit of our obedience we truly will have happiness in our marriage. Joy is made up of self-sacrifice and living in the joy of the one we love.

[HeartlandGal]

I think alot of it also has to do with the fact that many Christian men are not being trained properly. They honestly aren't sure how to lead in thier homes. Not because they don't want to. But because if the grew up in a home where there was no example of it, if their mentors aren't setting that example and if their churches which often times are failing in the examples.. they just aren't sure how to do it. They can read and study their bibles and I am sure that does help.

[deafchristian]

Jud. 4:4-5-9 This is important verse for men too. .

[kayhil]

I believe you are right. I also believe that the majority of men today are very selfish people who could care less about their wives and what they think or need.

[Gordon b]

I truly believe that the problem with marriages among believers needs to be squarely placed to a large extent on men. I am willing to agree to 50%

[deafchristian]

I am willing to agree to 50%

yes, 50% is your fault, and 50 % is her fault....

you both are sinners :D:

[Not by Sight]

I disagree that men are primarily to blame for relationships failing. I mean, how do you communicate the importance of a family issue... get on the same page... with someone who just refuses to "get it". When speaking in the simplest terms to your spouse still results in a a communication breakdown. No, the problem is on both people's shoulders. The man can only take so much blame if the woman won't work with him to come to some common ground. THAT'S what I've seen in my failed and really all of the relationships I've been exposed to.

In fact, I would say that the reason more relationships are failing is because the whole premise of relationships has changed. People go into relationships asking "what can I get out of it" rather than "what can I contribute"? If you have one person contributing and the other is not holding up their end or even the least bit interested in holding up their end, what CAN you do?

The problem is not as black and white as some of you are making it. I now know this first hand.

I have not read the rest of the thread, but felt compelled to respond to your post before continuing on in my reading.

At what point does SOMEONE, ANYONE take responsibility? I think Bhiles post is a beautiful one and it addresses men, who were given by GOD the responsibility of being the leader of the family. As a woman, I confess I am often wrong and flawed, and I take responsibility for myself to let God work in me and on me to make me a better wife (especially since my husband is not saved and I cannot and will not change him myself). You cannot control your spouse. Only God can work on someone's heart.

However, doesn't it make sense that the men, who are charged with leadership also change themselves and do as God commanded? God rewards obedience. Perhaps if a man is struggling in his marriage, once he gets into his right position in the family through submitting himself to the Lord and being willing to be a living sacrifice to his own family, perhaps things will change in his home as God has opportunity to begin working!

This is about being a grown up and doing things God's way.

[God's gardener]

The problem with marriages between believers is that they don't place God first. IMHO. When both partners place God on the top of the list and truly desire to follow His will then the marriage becomes more solid.

[Sonlight]

BHiles,
Great post.

[savedb/cofJesus]

A woman needs to marry a man who loves Jesus above all else (even her). :thumb


I never would have agreed with this statement before I was saved. Now I can't see why I would not have agreed:wacko

I also believe that a wife will respond emotionally based upon how her husband tends to her spirit. She can't help but be affected by him emotionally: Gen 3:16 "....yet your desire shall be for your husband".

I agree:bounce

[biblemommy]

I truly believe that the problem with marriages among believers needs to be squarely placed to a large extent on men. We are given so much by God and we abuse and are unthankful for what He has given.

God gave us leadership roles in the home, yet so many times we see it as a ruler instead of servant. Many things would work so much better for us if our wives truly understood our love for them. How does a wife understand love?

The same way we understand God's love for us.

Sacrifice. It has become such a dirty word in the realm of the "abundant life" but we are explicitly told our life is to be one of sacrifice. I doubt that there would ever be a woman to ever leave a man if she truly felt loved and he sacrificed for her to show her that love. I am sure that there are some women with a psychological problems that this would not be true however the vast majority I believe would never dream of such a thing. We need to be thinking constantly of her needs and her stresses, how we can make her life easier and fulfilling, getting the focus off of ourselves. Looking ahead for things that help her outlook on life and consistantly drawing and encouraging her relationship with God. We many times fail to see her as a sister in Christ -a co-heir of heaven, a co-laborer on earth. Teaching the children to honor and respect and give to her so that her self-worth is found in her God and her family and not in the praises of her job or her boss. We have been given an awesome charge. The fruit of what can happen when a woman is truly loved and knows it is immeasurable in its produce. Your children stability and confidence in right, turn into the might arrows in your expert hand to reach this world for the kingdoms sake. And you fulfill the example of Christ to a lost and dying world.

Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

Show her today.


in this one inccedent I would totally be ok with cloning a man who believes this way!!!:clap :clap