The Church is for what?

[Dear2HIM]

I am on a serious quest to discover and disect the new changing views of the purpose of the Church. There seems to be a new "call" to the leaders of churches today to change from viewing church as something for themselves, to something for the culture outside their walls. Of course, there are the extreme views on both side: rigid holding to the traditions which are not related to doctrine, but more with style, and second being the emergent, relevant, culture-driven, designed mostly for the comfort of the "pre-Christian" while leaving the Christian alone to figure it out alone.

I am looking to reconcile the two, and find the BIBLICAL model...if that is possible.

What are your thoughts, as to what the purpose of the Church is? Is it for Christians alone? Is it specifically missional in nature? Is a mix?



I am asking please to refrane from using this thread for promoting specific pastors/leaders/styles whom you feel are making an impact or threat to the church....if at all possible....and only present such information if it is completely relevant and not an effort to ride off of other threads.

[cameron222]

The church is for God and we go there to corporately worship Him and offer encouragement to the dying and hurting and to share in the joys and triumphs of those who have overcome.

And in our church, we preach the salvation message and invite others to become a part of God's family by accepting the blood bought redemption of His only begotten son Jesus Christ.

Then we socialize and teach and preach and sing and learn and get ourselves equipped for the times that lay ahead.

Its an oasis in a desert of despair.

[Dear2HIM]

Cameron,
I appreciate your participation :):
You do not need to site exact scriptures, but if you have any examples from scripture which assisted you in this understanding, I would appreciate it.

Just had a thought while typing this....but I bet our own experiences, both good or bad, also have an impact on our view of what the gathering of Christians together should be all about. I have had my own ideas of what Church is, and then as I got older they changed somewhat, and now I am being challenged again to look at my views again. Would love to just get this concrete so that I am not tossed to and fro by every trend and Church Leadership book and seminar thrown at me to read and "ponder over"!

[cameron222]

Dear2....I am getting ready to go to prayer meeting and I do not have time to look up and post all of the applicable verses, but I will give you a basic summary for your research.

We are told to not forsake the assemblying of ourselves together and even more so as we see the day approaching.

We are given gifts for the building up of the body and we need an assembly in order to do that.

The pastors are to protect the flock, so thus there needs to be a flock (church)

We are to pray for one another and thus we need to be in a group (church) to know the various needs.

Then there is the Revelation message to the seven "churches."

Paul established churches on his journeys.

Etc., etc.

See ya later..... :):

[blitzkreig]

I am looking to reconcile the two, and find the BIBLICAL model...if that is possible..What is the "biblical model"?

In the biblical model "we" are the church. It is not a place to go.

At one time the "gathering" guaranteed the presence of God ... Mat 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
However, today, in this dispensation we have the Holy Spirit actually indwelling inside of us. One needs no "gathering" to assemble God.

Our bodies are literally the temple of the Living God ... 2Co 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Today we get together for fellowship and joint worship. It's important for the Christian community to support one another.

But arguably this Rapture Ready Forum is "church" to a lot of folks...

.

[BHiles]

The Church


What is a Church


The word church comes from two words. One word is ek which means out, and the other word is kaleo which means to call. The word

is ekklesia and it means a called-out group. That is the word for church in the New Testament. It is a called-out group. When I refer to the church, I am referring to a called-out group. In the Bible it is often called an assembly, but it is not just an assembly. It is a calledout assembly. Let me explain further.

1. In order to be a church, the people called-out must have been a part of another group.

2.They must have been called out of that group.

3. They must have formed another group.

The church is a called-out assembly because they were called out from the world to assemble. So, they must have been in the world, they must have been called out from the world, and they must have formed a new group in order for them to be a called-out assembly.

This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us. Acts 7:38

Israel was called a church in the wilderness, but Israel was not a church when she was in Egypt because she was not yet a called-out assembly. When she was in Canaan she was not yet a church because she was not a called-out assembly. God called them out from Egypt, and they assembled in the wilderness. They were then a called-out assembly. They were called out of Egypt to assemble and form another group in the wilderness. So, God calls Israel a church in the wilderness.

Some therefore cried one thing, and some another: for the assembly was confused. Acts 19:32a

Paul was in jeopardy because of the uproar of the silversmiths in Ephesus. People were getting saved and the silversmiths, who made little goddesses of Diana, were having their businesses hurt. They were upset with Paul. That word assembly is the word ekklesia. That mob of people assembled from Ephesus which was trying to do Paul harm was a part of another group. They were called together out of that group to form another group. The purpose of forming that group was to do harm to Paul. So, in the Bible there were many different churches. I do not mean religious organizations, but groups of people who were called out to assemble.

But if ye inquire any thing concerning other matters, it shall be determined in a lawful assembly. Acts 19:39

Once again the word assembly or ekklesia is used. The governing body of Israel was called an assembly. It was an ekklesia, or a church. They were not a New Testament church, but anytime there was a group called out from another group to assemble, that assembly was called an ekklesia. In the United States, our Senate and our Congress are called out from us to assemble in Washington, DC. That is what was called an ekklesia or an assembly. In fact, in many states the State Legislature is called the State Assembly. That is exactly what it was in those days.

The word synagogue comes from a word which means a group of people meeting, but to be an ekklesia it had to be people of the same kind. For example, if a group of lawyers come out from the rest of society, meet in some city, and have an assembly or convention, that is an ekklesia. If there is a medical convention, it is an ekklesia. There must be a common bond in order for it to be called an ekklesia. It would be called a synagogue if there was no common bond.

In the New Testament church our common bond is that we have received Jesus as the living Son of God. It was upon this that the church was built. "Upon this rock I will build my church." What rock? Not Peter, but on the profession that Peter made when he said, "Thou art the Son of the Living God." We have a common bond. The world knows nothing about that bond. We have a common Book that we love. We have a common Saviour Whom we love. We have a common Holy Spirit Who lives in our bodies. A group of people which assembles because they have a common bond qualifies them to be called an ekklesia or a church.

Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write... Revelation 2:1

And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write... Verse 8

And to the angel of the church in Pergamos write.. . Verse 12

And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write... Verse 18

And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write... Revelation 3:1

And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write... Verse 7

And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write... Verse 14

All of these were churches. They were assembled, they had a common bond and a common purpose, but it was not the same purpose that the church of Philadelphia had. The Catholic church across the street from our church in Hammond is a church. It is not a New Testament church, but it is a church because it is a called-out assembly. That means that the church at Ephesus, Sardis, Pergamos, Philadelphia, Thyatira, and even the wicked Laodicea were all churches. So, liberal churches are churches. They are not New Testament churches, but they are churches.

Jesus started an ekklesia of His own. He did not start the ekklesia. The word ekklesia was used before Jesus started His ekklesia. There was an ekklesia in the wilderness back in the Old Testament days. Jesus started His own ekklesia based on the bond of accepting Christ as Saviour and as the Son of God. There is no bond like the bond which is in a true New Testament church, because He is that bond.

When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea of Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am? And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets. He saith unto them, But whom say ye that Jam? And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock! will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Matthew 16: 13-18

Jesus was building one of the following when He started the church.

1. a church consisting of all believers.

2. a denomination.

3. a congregation.

All three cannot be true, and no two can be true. Either Jesus started a local assembly, a denomination, or the church is composed of all believers (an invisible church). Jesus said, "upon this rock! will build my church." He did not say, "I will build my churches." We must then decide which one is right.

Some people say that the church is composed of all believers. Some people say the church is a denomination. Some people say that the church is a congregation of people. Which is right? Let's reason.

1. It could not be all believers. If it is all believers, what happened from Adam to Christ? If the church was started on Pentecost, which it was not (that will be covered in a later chapter), then what happened to all of the Old Testament people? Were they not saved? If, when a person gets saved, he is baptized into the church, (an invisible body of all the same people), then Moses and Abraham were unsaved. Therefore, it could not be all believers.

2. The church that Jesus started in Matthew 16:8 was not started then. He said he was going to start it. It was the same church which was mentioned in Matthew 18:17.

And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican. Matthew 18:17

The word church used here is the same word ekklesia which is mentioned in Matthew 16:18. How can you tell something to an invisible church? You cannot tell it to every Christian if every Christian forms the church. When He said to tell it to the church, He was referring to a group of people who have been called out of the world. When you get saved, you are called out of the world, but God has an institution he wants you to join, so you can reassemble. It must be a local body of believers. If it is the local body of believers, then it is not invisible.

The average Baptist does not believe or know this. We do not teach it any more. Jesus started only one church. It cannot be visible and invisible. So, if it is the visible church, there can be no invisible church. I take issue with Mr. Scofield when he refers to the visible and the invisible churches. The true church is a group of born-again baptized believers, who have a common bond of having Christ in their lives, having been born again, made new creatures in Christ Jesus, and trying to propagate that wonderful message, so that others can receive the message of grace. That is the true church. This needs to be emphasized. We accepted inter-denominational teaching, and, as a result, have damaged the true church.

When the invisible church-goers want to raise money, they always go to a visible church to raise the money. Isn't that interesting? They do not send their money-raisers out to invisible churches, because invisible churches give invisible money. There is a mentality that is sweeping this nation that if you "Grow in grace" you do not need to have a local church. People have the idea that you can join the Gideons, Youth for Christ, Child Evangelism, or some other group instead of being a part of a local New Testament church. Any ministry can do better in a true church than it can outside of it. The greatest child evangelism program is in the local church. The greatest youth for Christ program is in the local church. More Jewish people are reached by the local church than in all of the Jewish ministries that are operated outside of the church.

But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man. For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings. For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren, Saying I will declare thy name unto my brethren, in the midst of the church will! sing praise unto thee. Hebrews 2:9-12

Jesus said that He was going to preach and sing in the church. The church could not have started on Pentecost. It had to have been started in the personal ministry of Christ because the Bible says that He sang and preached in it. It is not talking about His invisible presence in the church. It is talking about the fact that Jesus went to church during His earthly ministry. He would not start a church, and then not show up when it met.

Often, a businessman will get saved in a church like First Baptist. He loves it. He teaches a Sunday school class. He gets a bus route. Then these "super church" believers come in and "promote" him out of the local church. Because he is a businessman, he thinks he has risen above the local church. You will never rise above the local church. Men across this country by the thousands seldom go to their own church, because they have been given some job in a spiritual service outside the true church which is the local church. They eventually die on the spiritual vine.

What America needs is not more telecasts. We need more local churches. I do not like the phrase, "Electronic Church." There is no such thing as an "Electronic Church." There will never be anything that can substitute for a place where people come and have the Word of God taught to them by a pastor, and a place where they can build their lives. The purpose of Hyles-Anderson College is to train men to go out and work in churches.

But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all and to the spirits of just men made perfect. Hebrews 12:22, 23

The word church is the word ekklesia. This passage is talking about the rapture. The church is a called-out group. At the rapture, all believers will be called out from this earth, meet in the air, and assemble in the sky. Then, and only then, will we be a called-out assembly. That is what this passage is talking about.

There is a church being built right now, but it is not yet a church because it has not yet been called out and assembled. At this moment there is only one church and that is the local body. All believers are not a church because all believers have not yet been assembled. At the trumpet, the first resurrection, all believers will be assembled, and will become a called-out assembly, or a church. That is not the same as the New Testament church. It is the church of the first born which will be assembled in the sky.

What about the Scriptures that say the church is His body? That is a term of ownership. The local church belongs to Him. He is the head of it in the sense that He is the boss of it. Hyles-Anderson College is owned by the First Baptist Church. The local New Testament church is owned by Jesus. It is His possessive body.

And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are called according to his purpose. For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. Romans 8:28-30

Jesus wills that every person whose name is written in Heaven be part of a local church. Romans 8:28 is not for those who do not belong to a true church. You cannot be right with God and not belong to a true church. A family, who I loved very much wrote me a letter one day, that said, "Brother Hyles, we have had a wonderful time lately. For months now, we have not gone to church anywhere. We have just stayed at home and learned to know God better." No, they did not. Nobody learns to know God better outside the institution Jesus started than they can inside of it. You cannot be right with God and wrong with the ekklesia. You cannot be right with God and not belong to the ekklesia.

Our Baptist brethren in history died for this truth, yet many Baptists today do not even believe it. Never again talk about the invisible church, or the universal church. The word Catholic means universal church. Let the Catholics have that doctrine. There is no such thing according to the Bible. Jesus started one church. That church is the church in which you can hear a message. It is a church where Jesus preached and where Jesus sang. It is a church where people meet. It is a church that has membership and has people baptized. It is a church that has pastors and deacons. It is a local assembly of believers.

People write me letters saying, "Brother Hyles, we're moving to a certain town in a certain state, but we can't find a church there. What should we do?" I write back two words. "Don't move!" If you cannot find a church, God does not want you there. God wants every Christian in an ekklesia.

What this nation needs is more soul-winning New Testament churches in every neighborhood. We need men of God to start ekklesias all across this nation. That is why the Devil has attacked First Baptist Church so viciously. The Devil does not want ekklesias. May God in Heaven bring us back to the old-fashioned doctrine of the true church and not the dreamed up invisible church. - Dr. Jack Hyles

[Timothy]

Some refer to this verse as the "Timothy Principle"

II Timothy 2:2 And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also.



This chart helps explain a couple of ways a church or assembly can go wrong.

http://midacts.net/charts/bedore-pendulum_of_evangelistic_concern.jpg

[BHiles]

The Purpose of Going to Church

Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for the fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. And when he had so said, he shewed unto them his hands and his side. Then were the disciples glad, when they saw the Lord. Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you. And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:

Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst and said, Peace be unto you. John 20:19-23, 26

Not many people know the true reason why Jesus started the church. Let me give a couple of things which are not legitimate reasons, even though most people think they are.

1. The church was not started to be a place of worship.

You can worship God better alone than you can with others. You can also pray better alone than you can with others. When two people pray together, their prayers will too often be designed to impress each other. Every Christian should worship God in the beauty of His holiness. We should adore Him, worship Him, magnify Him, and honor Him. The idea that the church is a place to worship God came from Rome, not from the New Testament. There is only one place in the New Testament where the word worship is connected to a public service, and that deals with worshipping the Devil. There is no example in the entire New Testament of a Christian worship service.

God told the people in Amos 5:21-23, 1 hate, I despise your feast days, and! will not smell in your solemn assemblies.... I will not accept them.... Take thou away from me the noise of thy songs.... The church was not made to be a place of worship.

2. Jesus did not start the church as a place of evangelism. The evangelistic church is not in the Bible. The soul-winning church is. I am not against people getting saved at church, nor am I against an occasional evangelistic sermon. But, that is not the main purpose of the church, nor was it why the church was started. The New Testament church was a soul-winning institution where all of the members won people to Jesus.

And daily in the temple, and in every house, they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ. Acts 5:42

Some people believe that the New Testament church won the lost in the church and in house-to-house soul winning. That is half true. They did go house-to-house soul winning. The temple, however, was not the church, nor did they have church in the temple. The temple was the location of the big gala occasion when they had their feasts and when all of the people would gather in Jerusalem. The temple was also the place where they conducted their daily business. It was like our business district. This was not talking about witnessing in church, but about witnessing in public places as well as in people's homes.

And Saul was consenting unto his death. And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judaea and Samaria, except the apostles. Therefore they that were scattered abroad went every where preaching the word. Acts 8:1, 4

They witnessed everywhere. There was no place they did not go. The jail is part of everywhere. Downtown is part of everywhere. The street corner is part of everywhere. Rest homes are a part of everywhere. Neighborhoods are a part of everywhere. The homes where the poor, the lame, the halt, and the blind live are parts of everywhere. The New Testament church was not an evangelistic church. It was a soul-winning church, and they went everywhere doing so.

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. Mark 16:15

Jesus gave the Great Commission on several occasions. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and Acts all give different phrasings of the Great Commission. That does not mean that Jesus spoke it only one time, and that each of them gave it in their own words. They each quoted Jesus. He did not just give it once. One of those times was quoted in Mark. It is not talking about standing behind a pulpit and preaching. It is not directed to a congregation. It is directed to every creature.

An evangelistic church is where a preacher gets up and preaches on salvation. I am not against that, but it is not why the church was started. The evangelism was not to be done at the church. Soul winning was to be done where the people were.

Paul said For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ and him crucified. Some preachers take that as a mandate to preach on nothing except Jesus. That is not true. Paul wrote Timothy and said, Preach the word, but he said something else. He said to exhort. He said to rebuke. Sometimes the preacher is to preach the Word. Sometimes he is to be lovingly stern and rebuke. Sometimes he is to give advice, or exhort. God wants more than just the plan of salvation preached in the church.

Jesus said in Matthew to teach all nations. That word in Matthew is the Greek word "ethnos" which means ethnics or races. Mark 16:15 says, to go into all the world. The word "kosmos" is the word arrangement. When Jesus started the church, he started a soul-winning church. Soul winning was not the purpose of the church, it was the fruit of the church and the result of the church.

In the first century the local churches were soul-winning churches. They were scattered abroad everywhere with everybody preaching or soul winning. Peter did not preach the evangelistic sermon on Pentecost as many think. The Bible says that every nation under Heaven was represented at Pentecost and every man heard the Gospel. Many people were doing the soul winning. It was not just Peter. I am not against having an evangelistic service, but that was not why Jesus started the church, nor was it the way the New Testament church operated.

In the first century, our churches were soul-winning churches. The people came to church for the real purpose of the church. Then they went out from the church and won folks to Christ in the public places and neighborhoods and brought them back to church. Something happened shortly after the early church. The churches became evangelistic rather than soul winning. What is the difference?

A soul-winning church is where the people go out and win them and bring them back in to make a public profession.

An evangelistic church is where you invite sinners to come and the preacher tries to get them saved through his preaching. There is nothing wrong with that except the people go unfed.

For 1900 years the soul-winning church was lost.

In our generation the soul-winning church has been rediscovered. The First Baptist Church of Hammond has had a big part in that. All across America preachers are baptizing more converts than Spurgeon did. I am not nearly the preacher Spurgeon was, but First Baptist Church is a better church than Spurgeon had because we discovered the soul-winning church instead of the evangelistic church.

Evangelists have been being forced to change their ministries.

And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Ephesians 4:11, 12

The word perfecting means maturing. God gave apostles for the maturing of the saints. God gave prophets for the maturing of the saints. God gave evangelists for the maturing of the saints. God gave pastors and teachers for the maturing of the saints. All these were given for the perfecting of the saints for the work of the ministry. Every saint is commanded to do the work of the ministry. Every Christian is commanded to be a soul-winner. It is the evangelist's job to mature the Christians so they will better do the work of the ministry.

For many years evangelists were men who traveled across the country and preached revival meetings. These were actually evangelistic crusades, and they basically preached on salvation. I believe that God raised

them up, but I do not believe that God had this in mind for the New Testament church. Evangelists were given for the perfecting or maturing of the saints, so the saints could do the work of the ministry. Nobody in the New Testament went around preaching to great crowds of people in churches just to get people saved. They taught, exhorted, rebuked, and perfected them so that the saints could do the work of the ministry.

I am not against the evangelists who went into churches and preached on Heaven, Hell, salvation, the great white throne judgment, etc. Thank God for them, but they had to do it because churches were not doing the job of soul winning. God raised up these evangelists to go to churches and get people saved.

In our day, the evangelist is a preacher who does more of what the Bible says he is to do, the perfecting of the saints. We have lived in the age of the rediscovery of the soul-winning church.

Let us now look at the reasons for the starting of the church.

1. The church was started for comfort.

Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and said unto them, Peace be unto you. John 20:19

These people went to church because they were scared. That is one reason Jesus started the church. It was the place they could receive comfort in the midst of persecution.

Jesus met in the upper room the night that he was betrayed. (John 13 & 14) From there He went to the garden of Gethsemane where he was betrayed that night. It was on Wednesday that our Lord was crucified, so the church meets on Wednesday. Sunday was the day that our Lord rose from the dead, so the church meets on Sunday.

It had to be a church that met in the upper room because they had the Lord's Supper, which was given by the local church. It was also in the upper room that they met when He rose from the dead. (John 20:19 & 26) Consequently, they came to church for comfort. Our Saviour met with the apostles and said: Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. He was comforting them.

The church is a place to dispel the fears of the people. When somebody comes with an incurable disease, the church is supposed to help him dispel his fear. When people have a fear of financial reversal, the church is to help dispel their fear. The reason they assembled in the upper room was for the fear of the Jews. Coming together gave them more courage and strength than being alone.

2. It is a place for encouragement. Often people will not come to church because they have problems or because they are discouraged. That is why the church was started. That is why we are supposed to come. When you want to be alone is usually when you do not need to be alone. That is the time we most need to be in church.

Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. Hebrews 10:25

That means we are not to forsake the churching of ourselves together. It is especially true as we see the second coming of Jesus Christ coming closer. Why? Because there is a certain element of fear there. You come to church to be comforted in the fact that we are all going up together. When we come to church we get encouraged.

For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment; And ye have respect to him that weareth the gay clothing, and say unto him, Sit thou here in a good place; and say to the poor, Stand thou there, or sit here under my footstool: Are ye not then partial in yourselves, and are become judges of evil thoughts? James 2:2-4

There is one place in this world where a poor child can go and be just as important as the children of the Pastor, the deacons or the Sunday school teachers. The church is a place of encouragement for those who are looked down upon or despised in this world.

3. It is a place to give tithes to God.

Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye. Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in the store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when! come. I Corinthians 16:1

They tithed on the first day of the week, which is when they went to church. Sundays we are to bring our tithes and offerings to the church as well. The tithe or tenth is the smallest portion given in the Bible. Consequently, we go to church to give.

4. It is a place for maturing.

And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: Ephesians 4:11-15

The body of Christ is the local New Testament church. He owns it. God has given us the church, so that every time someone tries to deceive us with a false doctrine, we will not fall prey to the error. God has given us the church in order for us to become mature. He wants us to grow up. That is what it is all about. We are to come to church to mature. We will never outgrow the church. The church is there to help us to grow up. The preacher is there to help us grow up. The evangelist is there to help us to grow up. The quickest way to be deceived by false doctrines is to become unfaithful to church.

5. It is a place for inspiration to go soul winning.

And when they were assembled with the elders

Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them. And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted. And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All powers is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever! have commanded you: Matthew 28:12, 16-20a

The church is to inspire and instill in us the importance of going

soul winning. Most people will never walk inside the church, but we can go to them. Most people where we work will never walk inside our church, but we can take the message where they are. As a pastor, I am to inspire everybody to go soul winning. Four thousand people go soul winning from First Baptist Church every week. I am not satisfied with that. I want everybody to go soul winning every week. It is not the preacher's job to preach the unsaved down the aisle. It is the preacher's job to preach and inspire the individual Christians to go soul winning. That is God's plan.

6. It is a place for fellowship, to take the Lord's supper, to learn the Bible and to learn how to pray.

Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added to them about three thousand souls. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in the breaking of bread, and in prayers. Acts 2:41, 42

The word fellowship means communion. It is not referring to the typical fellowship of the church. It is referring to a communing in Christ with one another. It is a place where we share a "God Bless You" and "1 am praying for you" as we unite in the work of God. It is a place for the breaking of bread in the Lord's Supper as we remember together the price Jesus paid for us on Calvary.

These are the real reasons for the church. When we get away from these, the church fails to do that which we were called by the Saviour to do, and we look to church to be something different than what God ordained it to be. -Dr. Jack Hyles

[Benja32one]

The Body of Christ is the church. The local church is the place we are to meet and worship as a LOCAL TESTIMONY to our neighbors. That being said I believe the crux of the fuzzy thinking about the church today is a result of the mis-interpretation of the Great Commission linked with a skewed view of dispensational difference between the age of Law and the age of Grace, a comingling, if you will, of the principles of the law with the gospel when it comes to how when and where to worship as a N.T. believer. The church should be a 'watering trough, a spiritual restaurant' where one can eat and drink his fill of the Word of God in every meeting. However, when the 'we need to reach the world in this generation' idea is followed, many times with the teaching that the ''church's task" is to reach the lost, spiritual atrophy sets in because people are going to church and not finding what they need. Instead, they sit service after service and hear salvation sermons. Consequently they become afraid to witness as they are not familiar enough to 'give an answer for the hope that is in them', so they bring dead sinners to church, ask them to walk down an aisle and pray in a public display. THE LAST THING A MAN WHO IS DEAD IN TRESPASSES AND SINS WANTS TO DO IS BE NOTICED PUBLICLY. Evangelism is a one on one preaching. Why do you think Phillip was known as the evangelist? No pastor can be expected to successfully preach to the lost and saved at the same service, IMHO

[Dear2HIM]

You all are great. Thanks for all the info which I think I better just print out and go over tonight. I'll get back here tomorrow with my questions!
LOTS of reading material ! :thumb

[Caligirl]

You all are great. Thanks for all the info which I think I better just print out and go over tonight. I'll get back here tomorrow with my questions!
LOTS of reading material ! :thumb

Dear2Him,

"Safe?" said Mr. Beaver; "don't you hear what Mrs. Beaver tells you? Who said anything about safe?
'Course he isn't safe.
But he's good. He's the King, I tell you."

That is my most favorite quote from CS Lewis... :):
Great Thread...

[cameron222]

Hey Caligirl.....where ya been? :wave

[Caligirl]

Hey Caligirl.....where ya been? :wave

Hey Cameron :wave
I didn't have the internet for a WHOLE WEEK...LOL. Strange not having the cyber world at your finger tips... :laugh

[antitox]

I would like to add that it is pleasing to God when His people gather together in one accord. The church is His habitation, and He often moves in a special way among His people. the corporate gathering, I believe, is of utmost importance, and it is in those gatherings that God has moved in my life in special ways.

[Harley]

The church, both local and universal (with apologies to BHiles) is the Body of Christ, and as such it does what he would be doing if he were here (corporally).

What would that be? 1) Glorifying the Father by, 2) Strengthening those who beleive, and 3) challenging those who do not with the claims of the Kingdom.

Any model that does not contain both 2) and 3) falls short. Therefore I'd say the church is for the believing community and for the greater good of the culture.

[Harley]

Furthermore, I think what the church should be doing, both local abd universal (additional apologies to BHiles :fencing) can be found in the Great Commission.

The commission in a nutshell is to make disciples. Disciples are, by definitions, maturing believers. The commission is not to make just converts.

So, the church is for thoser outside who need to be made disciples, and the church is for those inside who need to be matured as disciples.

Both posts make the point it's both/and not either/or.

[Beth]

Furthermore, I think what the church should be doing, both local abd universal (additional apologies to BHiles :fencing) can be found in the Great Commission.

The commission in a nutshell is to make disciples. Disciples are, by definitions, maturing believers. The commission is not to make just converts.

So, the church is for thoser outside who need to be made disciples, and the church is for those inside who need to be matured as disciples.

Both posts make the point it's both/and not either/or.


I agree. The church is the saints, who worship, obey and serve Christ. The purpose of local churches in their gatherings is the training, exhorting, building up and maturing of the saints, so that they may go out and carry out the Great Commission in the outside world in which they live.

[FollowTheLamb]

I would suggest you start with the original source materials:
Eph. 1-3 will show you what the church is composed of, ideally.
Eph. 4-5 will show you the practice of the church in light of what it is from chaps. 1-3.
Read 1 Cor., Galatians, and Hebrews to find out how churches went wrong, and how they were corrected.
Read 1 Tim. to find out how a church preacher is to view himself and his relationship with the church.
1 John will show you the inner nature of those who are the real church.