Why do we have Church services on a Sunday and not a Saturday

[bleatingsheep]

The sermon at church this morning was based on the 4th commandment in Exodus 20 about remembering the Sabbath day and keeping it holy.
My question is that surely this refers to the Jewish sabbath from Friday to Saturday evening.
I have often been puzzled as to why Christians have Sunday as their Holy day and not Saturday.
I had make the refreshments so missed the end of the sermon.Just wondering whether we can get a discussion going.

[GAB]

First, let us say that honoring God is the first commandment.

Those who worship God on Sunday do so in honor of the Resurrection, which took place on a Sunday. As Christians were increasingly not welcome in synagogues as there grew to be a reaction against the Gospel, they began to worship on Sunday.

[onsolidrock]

Act 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

The disciples were the first to start the practice. Sunday was the day that Jesus was resurrected, thus the term the Lord's Day.

[4fish]

My understanding was that the sabbath was the seventh day of the week and that the Jewish calendar had Saturday as the seventh day. After the calendar was changed, Sunday became the seventh day.

But, IMO, so long as you devote one day to the Lord, that is your sabbath - no matter what day of the week.

Colossians 2:16,17 "Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day - things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ."

[josiah7]

:wave bleatingsheep,

You are not alone in being puzzled. After all the discussions (threads and bible studies), I still don't understand why.

[antsinmypants]

Act 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

The disciples were the first to start the practice..

Not even. It's tradition to break bread after the sabbath! After the services, it is tradition to meet and greet, and have a potluck dinner.

Often, if there is a guest speaker, they will resume speaking after the dinner if they have only a short time in the city.

We will be doing the same on Friday and Saturday this week (Shabbat and afterwards) when Bill Cloud of Shoreshim Ministries comes to visit us.

It goes back to the Council of Nicea and a little before that.

[antsinmypants]

My understanding was that the sabbath was the seventh day of the week and that the Jewish calendar had Saturday as the seventh day. After the calendar was changed, Sunday became the seventh day.

Yes, there are calendars in Europe that do just that even to this day, to justify the change.

[coltrek]

Read this http://www.bible.ca/H-sunday.htm if this make sense.

[HeIsEnough]

I have often been puzzled as to why Christians have Sunday as their Holy day and not Saturday.



James 2:10
For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.


Personally....I would not go there if I were you. Sounds like you do not carry that yoke at the moment, but if you decide to, be perfect about it will ya.

[HollowofHishand]

Hey Ants! :wave
Following on what Ants posted, is it possible that the verse from Acts meant the following:
After sundown on the Sabbath (making it now the next day or first day of the week), the disciples met to break bread (eat dinner) and Paul preached to them because he was going to leave the next day (morrow). That is why he spoke until midnight?

[antsinmypants]

Hey Ants! :wave
Following on what Ants posted, is it possible that the verse from Acts meant the following:
After sundown on the Sabbath (making it now the next day or first day of the week), the disciples met to break bread (eat dinner) and Paul preached to them because he was going to leave the next day (morrow). That is why he spoke until midnight?

:nod

[HeIsEnough]

So.....christians break the Sabbath by meeting on Sunday then? I am confused, speak plainly please.

[antsinmypants]

So.....christians break the Sabbath by meeting on Sunday then? I am confused, speak plainly please.

I said nothing of the sort.

[sixfingers]

I have always viewed Christ as our sabbath, which I believe Hebrews speaks about it in several places.

Heb 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

-

Heb 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Christ is our sabbath, and we should keep everyday holy, at least thats how I interpret it. As for Sunday worship, didn't early believers started that due to the resurrection?

Blessings!

[Workman]

uh oh, I have to work some weekends. Am I going to hell?

[HeIsEnough]

I said nothing of the sort.

That is part of the problem ants...you may not say it outright, but your meaning is unclear to me.

If you do not feel it is of any importance whether one worships on the Sabbath or on Sunday, say so.

If you feel there is importance to it, say that then.

Either way, your teaching is unclear. And any good teacher would clarify exactly what they mean, in the scriptures. I know I am a pain to you, so you will need to be patient. :D:

Anyhoo...sixfingers summed it up nicely.

[Bigdaddy]

uh oh, I have to work some weekends. Am I going to hell?

I dunno Workman, but maybe if you can skip work Sunday one time and go to church with me we can work on getting you saved lol. jk bro, i know you're already saved on fire for God!

[antsinmypants]

There's a singular difference in keeping Shabbat and worshipping G-d.

We are told to worship YHVH in spirit and truth, Pray without ceasing, and always. I.E. We worship HIM every day.

However, He did set aside and sanctify the 7th day.

For something to Be sanctified by YHVH, if we do not also ourselves, we are robbing only ourselves of the blessing that comes with it.

But, we are to meet when the assembly meets. We cannot change the Sabbath day, and Y'shua did not change it either. YHVH put it in place.

Y'shua is to be our rest.. and when we keep Shabbat/if we keep shabbat, we remember Him, and what He did for us. And Shabbat is the first feast... according to scripture.

All the feasts are the shadow of Him, He is the full color projected "person" of what happened, and what will happen on these dates. By keeping them/studying them- we learn more and more about Him that would not be understood otherwise.

[Glitchh]

The sermon at church this morning was based on the 4th commandment in Exodus 20 about remembering the Sabbath day and keeping it holy.
My question is that surely this refers to the Jewish sabbath from Friday to Saturday evening.
I have often been puzzled as to why Christians have Sunday as their Holy day and not Saturday.
I had make the refreshments so missed the end of the sermon.Just wondering whether we can get a discussion going.
Bleating, ants'pants is leading you in the right direction. Dispensationalism would have us believe that the Old and New Testaments are parts of two different works of God, whereas the New is actually built on the Old, perfecting it, not replacing it. The Lord is the author because he is the Living Word, how could he deny part of himself? The essence of our faith is His Word, not doctrines of men, be they Christian doctrines or Jewish. In fact the real truth is, YHVH is not the creator of religions, thus neither Judaism or Christianity are his creations, they are the works of men. So cling to all His Word, and not to doctrines or religions, for only His Word will lead you into relationship with Him and the finding of this relationship is the end-all, be-all of His word. And this relationship is a real relationship, not some empty doctrine.
The short answer is, keep the Sabbath, as the Ten Commandments teach us.

[HeIsEnough]

I still don't understand why.

....whereas the New is actually built on the Old, perfecting it, not replacing it.



Luke 6

Jesus Questioned About Fasting
33They said to him, "John's disciples often fast and pray, and so do the disciples of the Pharisees, but yours go on eating and drinking."
34Jesus answered, "Can you make the guests of the bridegroom fast while he is with them? 35But the time will come when the bridegroom will be taken from them; in those days they will fast."

36He told them this parable: "No one tears a patch from a new garment and sews it on an old one. If he does, he will have torn the new garment, and the patch from the new will not match the old. 37And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the new wine will burst the skins, the wine will run out and the wineskins will be ruined. 38No, new wine must be poured into new wineskins. 39And no one after drinking old wine wants the new, for he says, 'The old is better.' "

Luke 6
Lord of the Sabbath
1One Sabbath Jesus was going through the grainfields, and his disciples began to pick some heads of grain, rub them in their hands and eat the kernels. 2Some of the Pharisees asked, "Why are you doing what is unlawful on the Sabbath?"
3Jesus answered them, "Have you never read what David did when he and his companions were hungry? 4He entered the house of God, and taking the consecrated bread, he ate what is lawful only for priests to eat. And he also gave some to his companions." 5Then Jesus said to them, "The Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath."

6On another Sabbath he went into the synagogue and was teaching, and a man was there whose right hand was shriveled. 7The Pharisees and the teachers of the law were looking for a reason to accuse Jesus, so they watched him closely to see if he would heal on the Sabbath. 8But Jesus knew what they were thinking and said to the man with the shriveled hand, "Get up and stand in front of everyone." So he got up and stood there.

9Then Jesus said to them, "I ask you, which is lawful on the Sabbath: to do good or to do evil, to save life or to destroy it?"

10He looked around at them all, and then said to the man, "Stretch out your hand." He did so, and his hand was completely restored. 11But they were furious and began to discuss with one another what they might do to Jesus.

[Pendragon]

Here is what you ask yourselves.. What is a sin.... How do we determine what a sin is? now if we sin and relize we are sinning we do what? Repent? what is the definition of repent? well if we are repenting that means we are doing everything in our power not to sin and in doing so G-d sees our heart is remorseful even though our flesh is sinful and that because we repented and accpted Jesus as Messiah our sins are
forgiven. The first 4 commandments relate to loving G-d with all your heart mind and soul The remaining 6 relate to loving your neighbor as you would yourself. All are interdependant on each other in glorifying G-d and his sacrifice. Imagine if you will what would happen if say Gearge Bush said you can only have 9 of the 10 commandments how would not having one any one of them effect society and cause a domino of commiting the other sins. they all balance on each other without one the balance is gone. If we don't observe the sabbath or a day of gathering and worship of the lord as a group what happens to the church as a whole. Is G-d first in your life? do we not find ourselves worshiping the sun or the beer or the the money by working or playing that one day? If we steal wouldn't someone get mad and kill for that? and even if we did steal and got caught would we then be compelled to tell the truth? and by stealing are we not coveting? and in doing any of those things would your Mom and Dad be proud of the way you were acting?

Here are the definitins of the various words we are talking about and why giving up and not observing the lords day as a body effects our lives and our lives in following the will of G-d


Sin

is "any want of conformity unto or transgression of the law of God" (1 John 3:4;
Rom. 4:15), in the inward state and habit of the soul, as well as in the outward
conduct of the life, whether by omission or commission (Rom. 6:12-17; 7:5-24).
It is "not a mere violation of the law of our constitution, nor of the system
of things, but an offence against a personal lawgiver and moral governor who
vindicates his law with penalties. The soul that sins is always conscious that
his sin is (1) intrinsically vile and polluting, and (2) that it justly
deserves punishment, and calls down the righteous wrath of God. Hence sin
carries with it two inalienable characters, (1) ill-desert, guilt (reatus); and
(2) pollution (macula).", Hodge's Outlines. The moral character of a man's
actions is determined by the moral state of his heart. The disposition to sin,
or the habit of the soul that leads to the sinful act, is itself also sin (Rom.
6:12-17; Gal. 5:17; James 1:14, 15). The origin of sin is a mystery, and must
for ever remain such to us. It is plain that for some reason God has permitted
sin to enter this world, and that is all we know. His permitting it, however,
in no way makes God the author of sin. Adam's sin (Gen. 3:1-6) consisted in his
yielding to the assaults of temptation and eating the forbidden fruit. It
involved in it, (1) the sin of unbelief, virtually making God a liar; and (2)
the guilt of disobedience to a positive command. By this sin he became an
apostate from God, a rebel in arms against his Creator. He lost the favour of
God and communion with him; his whole nature became depraved, and he incurred
the penalty involved in the covenant of works. Original sin. "Our first parents
being the root of all mankind, the guilt of their sin was imputed, and the same
death in sin and corrupted nature were conveyed to all their posterity,
descending from them by ordinary generation." Adam was constituted by God the
federal head and representative of all his posterity, as he was also their
natural head, and therefore when he fell they fell with him (Rom. 5:12-21; 1
Cor. 15:22-45). His probation was their probation, and his fall their fall.
Because of Adam's first sin all his posterity came into the world in a state of
sin and condemnation, i.e., (1) a state of moral corruption, and (2) of guilt,
as having judicially imputed to them the guilt of Adam's first sin. "Original
sin" is frequently and properly used to denote only the moral corruption of
their whole nature inherited by all men from Adam. This inherited moral
corruption consists in, (1) the loss of original righteousness; and (2) the
presence of a constant proneness to evil, which is the root and origin of all
actual sin. It is called "sin" (Rom. 6:12, 14, 17; 7:5-17), the "flesh" (Gal.
5:17, 24), "lust" (James 1:14, 15), the "body of sin" (Rom. 6:6), "ignorance,"
"blindness of heart," "alienation from the life of God" (Eph. 4:18, 19). It
influences and depraves the whole man, and its tendency is still downward to
deeper and deeper corruption, there remaining no recuperative element in the
soul. It is a total depravity, and it is also universally inherited by all the
natural descendants of Adam (Rom. 3:10-23; 5:12-21; 8:7). Pelagians deny
original sin, and regard man as by nature morally and spiritually well;
semi-Pelagians regard him as morally sick; Augustinians, or, as they are also
called, Calvinists, regard man as described above, spiritually dead (Eph. 2:1;
1 John 3:14). The doctrine of original sin is proved, (1.) From the fact of the
universal sinfulness of men. "There is no man that sinneth not" (1 Kings 8:46;
Isa. 53:6; Ps. 130:3; Rom. 3:19, 22, 23; Gal. 3:22).

(2.) From the total
depravity of man. All men are declared to be destitute of any principle of
spiritual life; man's apostasy from God is total and complete (Job 15:14-16;
Gen. 6:5,6).

(3.) From its early manifestation (Ps. 58:3; Prov. 22:15).

(4.) It
is proved also from the necessity, absolutely and universally, of regeneration
(John 3:3; 2 Cor. 5:17).

(5.) From the universality of death (Rom. 5:12-20).
Various kinds of sin are mentioned, (1.) "Presumptuous sins," or as literally
rendered, "sins with an uplifted hand", i.e., defiant acts of sin, in contrast
with "errors" or "inadvertencies" (Ps. 19:13).

(2.) "Secret", i.e., hidden sins
(19:12); sins which escape the notice of the soul.

(3.) "Sin against the Holy
Ghost" (q.v.), or a "sin unto death" (Matt. 12:31, 32; 1 John 5:16), which
amounts to a wilful rejection of grace. Sin, a city in Egypt, called by the
Greeks Pelusium, which means, as does also the Hebrew name, "clayey" or
"muddy," so called from the abundance of clay found there. It is called by
Ezekel (Ezek. 30:15) "the strength of Egypt, "thus denoting its importance as a
fortified city. It has been identified with the modern Tineh, "a miry place,"
where its ruins are to be found. Of its boasted magnificence only four red
granite columns remain, and some few fragments of others.



repent

v 1: turn away from sin or do penitence [syn: atone] 2: feel remorse for; feel sorry for; be contrite about [syn: regret, rue]

atone

v 1: make amends for; "expiate one's sins" [syn: expiate, aby, abye] 2: turn away from sin or do penitence [syn: repent]



expiate

v : make amends for; "expiate one's sins" [syn: aby, abye, atone]

[70thWeek]

The Sabbath isn't about religion, it's about rest

[BHiles]

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

[antsinmypants]

The Sabbath isn't about religion, it's about rest

It's not about religion period. It's about honoring YHVH and resting in Him. The whole idea of it, is that it's been sanctified by Him for us to totally stop everything we do in the week and focus on him.

Think of it this way. It's "Date day" for the bride and groom. They set one day aside to talk and fellowship and study and meditate wholly on him. If we really think about it.. it's a little over 10%... like an offering actually + Tithe of time to Him.

For me, I enjoy it. I get to stop everything that makes me all frustrated in life, and go "Ok.. now it's YOUR turn to steer me around today, show me everything you want me shown, and without "commercial interruptions"."

It's not like I don't let Him do "His thang"... because I do. it's just the interruptions are work, and family and chores... and even being single, you still have those things 6 days a week.

For me during the week, I have a hard time seperating the "mundane work" from seeking the Spiritual-- because something always interrupts, and I have to always do that something.

Now, again I will say we are given these sanctified things which totally are the Shadow of Messiah and always teach us new things of Him.

But, we have the option to not keep that, or to keep it :noidea

It's up to us.

Again imho, I enjoy life much better than I did, by doing this than I did by rushing around and not stopping completely on one day. I get to enjoy the company of believers in a relaxed atmosphere and totally learn from, with and without them... I didn't get that before.

But of course, I do worship and pray and study every other day, and I get "caught up" on everything else on Sunday. I like to think of Sunday as my springboard for the rest of the week... and Shabbat for my "banquet day"-- feasting on everything the L-rd lays out.

During the week I can snack and enjoy the snacking, but during shabbat, I can eat my heart out.

According to Paul's writings to colossians, no one can say "do not do this" to me, when G-d has led me in, just as I cannot force anyone to do as I do.

G-d is to lead each and every person individually, but even in so leading, He never negates His word which He has spoken before.

Something sanctified by Him, never loses it's sanctification.



Just some thoughts.

[70thWeek]

The point of the creation account was two-fold. To show who the agent of creation was and to establish Sabbath theology. God set the example.

[antsinmypants]

The point of the creation account was two-fold. To show who the agent of creation was and to establish Sabbath theology. God set the example.


Well, It does show "The agent of Creation" which is Y'shua (Aleph Tav)-- but... He showed it even in the first verse of Genesis with "Beresheith Bara El-him Et..."

Over and Over we See Him in Creation, and dealing with nations, and even with us...

I'm unsure what you mean precicely about "Establish[ing] [a] Sabbath Theology".

Care to clarify? :confused

[70thWeek]

The need for a day of rest.

[antsinmypants]

ah.