Reaping what we Sow. The Fruit of Abortion.

[MrMannn]

America crossed a thresh hold this week. Euthinasia.
The arguments pro and con about the Terri case do not change the fact that a judge ordered the death of a woman WITHOUT A LIVING WILL.
There was another story here on RR about a disabled baby aborted against his parents wishes.

When abortion was first being debated, a prediction was made. Abortion would ultimately lead to euthinasia. and it happened this week. When the Supream Court refused to review the case, a prescedent was allowed to stand: the judicially ordered death of a disabled patient. there was NO living will.

Kevorkian broke the ice, and is in jail now.
Terri is the legal standard.
Its not a far step towards euthinasia for the elderly and disabled.

We sowed the seeds of abortion. And now the fruit is ripening.
Welcome to the future.
Come soon, Lord. Please.

[JustGodsChild]

I agree Mr. Mannn, and it's a sad, sad world we live in. Killing out of convenience is what it boils down to.

[sandy111]

I always wondered "how long"....

people did'nt want their children, and now the children will not want or take care
of their parents.

and I think this applies to terri's situation too.
shes an inconvience. and all this boils down to is "sheer selfishness".

wait another 20 yrs. what a mess it will be.
in the last days the bible says people will be without natural affection.

[Jiggy37]

Abortion is certainly an awful and frightening thing. :(: The vast majority are done for the sake of convenience--but then, perhaps that's part of our failure as a society, because certainly for many of these aborted babies there wouldn't have been a very pleasant home life in a foster home or orpahange or anywhere else, and so very few seem willing to adopt. :sigh

And I do agree that it's extremely dangerous and scary in general to start doing things to people who can neither give nor refuse consent, especially things as ugly as dehydration.





Now, as for the other side of the coin (not in regards to Terri, but the "fruit of abortion") that I'll bring up just because I'm hoping it might be discussed (which doesn't mean that I agree with it)... :noidea
According to one article I remember seeing in the political forum (http://www.rr-bb.com/showthread.php?p=2127787#post2127787), part of the fruit of abortion was that more would-have-been-Democrats never got to be Democrats since they were aborted by their Democrat parents, thus Bush won instead of Gore. :wacko
Does that mean that abortion's good? Certainly not.

I think it's dangerous to apply the "fruits" verse in some of the ways I've seen it done, simply because sometimes there are negative consequences of a positive thing, or positive consequences of a negative thing. But like I said, I don't agree with the above--I think this entire situation is a negative consequence of a negative thing. However, I just disagree with the method of proof being used to prove it's so. :noidea

[MrMannn]

2018 is the year there will be more people recieving Social security than paying into it.
Its not going to be too great a leap of logic to hear, "The elderly have a duty to die, and make way for the young." "The elderly are a burden on the youth."
"He has Alzthimers, he doesn't know what life is anymore."

I can see hospitals refusing to treat elderly patients, because they haven't got long anyways. "There won't be any benifit to her quality of life, we can make it easy and quick." The rationing of health care begins here.

[MrMannn]

Jiggy, lets not bring the negativity of the political forum here in Christian chat, OK? please?

[Christine]

http://edition.cnn.com/2004/HEALTH/12/01/netherlands.mercykill/

[MrMannn]

Christine, THAT is a scary article!

[JustGodsChild]

Van Yijlick said that to his knowledge, the killing of newborns is not common -- just a few cases yearly. No official statistics exist on terminally ill children's lives being terminated, he said

That was from the article, obviously they are not including abortions. Just newborn babies who were "allowed" to live. The article is disturbing to say the least.

[sandy111]

I think too in our country we are in a different state of mind.
we cared for our people...Gods word gave that to us. We "were" a light to the world not anymore.
with him there is mercy and life.

but the worldly minded have never cared for people for the most part.
abortions have always been, throwing babys away still happens in parts of
this world.

look at many who preach, they don't even believe the scriptures,
that Jesus was even the son of God. Its easy money for them. :mad

sacredness of everything good and decent is being thrown on the scrapeheap.


How many sit in church every sunday and have NO compassion in their daily lifes,
they lie, cheat , steal, and walk no different than the world.
yet they say they are "born again".
I say of what spirit?

right now, my own children have seen this in our extended familys.
my children could see that people were not following Gods word, that there was little to no respect for it and it has really caused me trouble, wondering if they will realize
thats people not God.

[Elizabeth_S]

America crossed a thresh hold this week. Euthinasia.
The arguments pro and con about the Terri case do not change the fact that a judge ordered the death of a woman WITHOUT A LIVING WILL.
There was another story here on RR about a disabled baby aborted against his parents wishes.

When abortion was first being debated, a prediction was made. Abortion would ultimately lead to euthinasia. and it happened this week. When the Supream Court refused to review the case, a prescedent was allowed to stand: the judicially ordered death of a disabled patient. there was NO living will.

Kevorkian broke the ice, and is in jail now.
Terri is the legal standard.
Its not a far step towards euthinasia for the elderly and disabled.

We sowed the seeds of abortion. And now the fruit is ripening.
Welcome to the future.
Come soon, Lord. Please.
It is written.

[UNeverEverNo]

As Christians, this is our own fault. We have turned the other cheek when we weren't supposed to.

As Christians, we have sat by while over 45 MILLION babies were killed in the last 32 years. 45 MILLION ! ? That's a number too large for our imaginations. Since we can't conceive of it, we (disregarding those who spend hours and hours to defeat this sin) put it aside so we won't have to deal with it.

As Christians, we tend to ignore atrocities if they don't cause us personal hardship.

As Christians, we sit here in our little comfy homes surfing the internet after a too-hefty meal. We snicker to each other when the bulletin is incorrect about the hymnal number of the next worship song.

As Christians, we'd better wake up and REALLY try to "WWJD".

[JustGodsChild]

As Christians, this is our own fault. We have turned the other cheek when we weren't supposed to.

As Christians, we have sat by while over 45 MILLION babies were killed in the last 32 years. 45 MILLION ! ? That's a number too large for our imaginations. Since we can't conceive of it, we (disregarding those who spend hours and hours to defeat this sin) put it aside so we won't have to deal with it.

As Christians, we tend to ignore atrocities if they don't cause us personal hardship.

As Christians, we sit here in our little comfy homes surfing the internet after a too-hefty meal. We snicker to each other when the bulletin is incorrect about the hymnal number of the next worship song.

As Christians, we'd better wake up and REALLY try to "WWJD".

Really? Wow, how do you know "We" haven't do anything while 45 million babies were killed? All you know is what you see here on RR, you don't know what people do in their every day lives...

[UNeverEverNo]

Really? Wow, how do you know "We" haven't do anything while 45 million babies were killed? All you know is what you see here on RR, you don't know what people do in their every day lives...There are many, many Christians who work for pro-life causes. But there are many, many, many who do not.

Actually, I know a little more than what I read here on RR. I am involved in pro-life work. And I know from personal experience that it is often difficult to get people involved.

[Morningstarlet]

2018 is the year there will be more people recieving Social security than paying into it.
Its not going to be too great a leap of logic to hear, "The elderly have a duty to die, and make way for the young." "The elderly are a burden on the youth."
"He has Alzthimers, he doesn't know what life is anymore."

I can see hospitals refusing to treat elderly patients, because they haven't got long anyways. "There won't be any benifit to her quality of life, we can make it easy and quick." The rationing of health care begins here.

I agree Mr. Mannn, I think we went down a slippery slope when we opened the door to legal abortion. In 2018 I will turn 60, if I live to 80 I could be one of those considered a burden on society. I pray we're raptured out of here long before then. :freaked :faint

[JustGodsChild]

There are many, many Christians who work for pro-life causes. But there are many, many, many who do not.

Actually, I know a little more than what I read here on RR. I am involved in pro-life work. And I know from personal experience that it is often difficult to get people involved.

I work at a pregnancy crisis center but other people have causes they are passionate about other than abortion. We all have causes that we stand up for. Just because someone isn't doing something about abortion, don't assume they don't have another conviction they are working on. Their convictions aren't your convictions and vice versa.

[zealous4zion]

Originally Posted by UNeverEverNo
As Christians, this is our own fault. We have turned the other cheek when we weren't supposed to.

As Christians, we have sat by while over 45 MILLION babies were killed in the last 32 years. 45 MILLION ! ? That's a number too large for our imaginations. Since we can't conceive of it, we (disregarding those who spend hours and hours to defeat this sin) put it aside so we won't have to deal with it.

As Christians, we tend to ignore atrocities if they don't cause us personal hardship.

As Christians, we sit here in our little comfy homes surfing the internet after a too-hefty meal. We snicker to each other when the bulletin is incorrect about the hymnal number of the next worship song.

As Christians, we'd better wake up and REALLY try to "WWJD".

I agree with you 100% There is a holocaust going on in america regarding the killing of the unborn and millions of people are are just looking the other way.

[greatestislove]

people did'nt want their children, and now the children will not want or take care
of their parents.


:thumb


As Christians, this is our own fault. We have turned the other cheek when we weren't supposed to.

As Christians, we have sat by while over 45 MILLION babies were killed in the last 32 years. 45 MILLION ! ? That's a number too large for our imaginations. Since we can't conceive of it, we (disregarding those who spend hours and hours to defeat this sin) put it aside so we won't have to deal with it.

As Christians, we tend to ignore atrocities if they don't cause us personal hardship.

As Christians, we sit here in our little comfy homes surfing the internet after a too-hefty meal. We snicker to each other when the bulletin is incorrect about the hymnal number of the next worship song.

As Christians, we'd better wake up and REALLY try to "WWJD".

:thumb

[ILJ]

I agree Mr. Mannn, I think we went down a slippery slope when we opened the door to legal abortion. In 2018 I will turn 60, if I live to 80 I could be one of those considered a burden on society. I pray we're raptured out of here long before then. :freaked :faint

I hear what you're saying. I'll be 59 in 2018. If I live to be 80, I, too, might be considered one of those burdens. My grandmother passed away a couple years ago as an Alzheimer's patient. While it was hard for me to go up to the nursing home and see this lovely lady that was a shadow of what she once was, I still liked being able to look into her beautiful blue eyes, which were still beautiful at the age of 81. There is no way I could have looked into those eyes, even though they didn't know me, and give the doctor the "OK" to end her life.

And, yes, I agree with you...I pray, too, that we'll be raptured long before then. :nod

[crtwhlfrchrst]

Why is everyone trying to make out those "evil judges" as some sort of life-hating euthanasists? Hundreds of judges reviewed this case for over 15 years, and not one (not ONE) ever fell on the side of the Shindlers. Now, I wish Teri could have been given over to her parents and allowed treatment - I prayed she would live too - but I don't think the legal side of this case had anything to do with euthanasia. It was only ever about the right of the state or federal government to intervene in what was ultimately a family dispute. Why is it that conservatives want to cling to certain beliefs until a certain case comes along, and then they jump to the other side of the fence? Conservatives are all about limiting the government - but suddenly in this case, they want the govn. to jump into the ring and take over? Suppose it was you, and you DID know your spouse wanted to die with dignity, but the governmnet stepped in and said, "no, you must let her lie there and soil herself for the next 20 years until she drowns in her own bodily fluids!" I think you'd be pretty miffed! It was sad that Schiavo would not give Terri a shot at rehab - but unfortunate as the situation was, I think the courts were on the right side in this case.

[Redmow]

I agree, the government should not have become involved but they did.

Why the morphine if she isn't conscious? A little doubt there? If there is any shred of doubt, I would rather side with life....any day.

If her husband truly cared for her, then why the hypocrisy? Fighting for 15 years to starve her because it was her wish...and yet ignoring her religious beliefs for the burial? Something doesn't jive with this whole thing.

At the beginning of this mess, the killing of Terri would have rested upon the head of her husband but now it rests upon this government.

Please, crt, don't label me as one of the 'conservatives' wanting the government to intervene. I want government out of our lives, period. But, I'm sorry, God's morality sits higher than our Constitution...if you think not, do you think that great document can save a man or woman?

[crtwhlfrchrst]

I guess I'm just turned off by how people on both sides of this issue are using her for their platforms - I know the people here have good hearts, and that this was a heated and emotional issue. I just think that if there had been certain, slight differences, then people would be taking different sides of the issue. But because of the emotional attachments to such cases, we tend to ignore our better judgment sometimes. The judges all had a difficult job to do, but like I said, not a one decided in her parents favor - that tells me they all agreed on the lawful side of the case.

None of that is to say that what Michael did was right. I think he is at best a selfish and uncaring man, and at worst quite possibly a monster and a party to involuntary manslaughter! I hope this case will never ease off of his conscience!

[Dilferthecat]

I work at a pregnancy crisis center but other people have causes they are passionate about other than abortion. We all have causes that we stand up for. Just because someone isn't doing something about abortion, don't assume they don't have another conviction they are working on. Their convictions aren't your convictions and vice versa.

This year is the first year I've become involved with our local crisis pregnancy center. My prayer sister and I are going to be our church's volunteers at the local Walk for Life. I hate abortion, and I thank God for the opportunity to become involved. However, I'm a single mom who works 40 hours a week, and my main areas of ministry are at-risk teenagers and intercessory prayer. I will become involved in the Walk for Life this year, but honestly none of us have time to actively work on all issues that we feel passionate about. We can't do everything, but we still care and should do what we can.

:hug

Lynne

[Christine]

Well, you can't deny that it is a slippery slope -- and here from another angle:

If 45 million babies hadn't been killed, we may not be in the Social Security mess we are in right now.

Good thing that they are allowing euthanasia of the terminally ill (Oregon) and disabled (Florida). Once we get the elderly on board, that will fix that whole SS/Medicare problem, aye?

:sigh

[cameron222]

Christine I was just getting ready to post that. Plus look at all the goods and services that would have been needed for this large a group and the jobs and wealth creation that would have come from supplying those goods and services.

The moral aspect of abortion is surely wrong, but man will now reap the whirlwind in economic and social ills from such a demonic decision.

[Christine]

Indeed.

Politicos want to clamor about the economy. Pity we murdered the working force that would have supported it.

[crtwhlfrchrst]

Well, you can't deny that it is a slippery slope -- and here from another angle:

If 45 million babies hadn't been killed, we may not be in the Social Security mess we are in right now.

Good thing that they are allowing euthanasia of the terminally ill (Oregon) and disabled (Florida). Once we get the elderly on board, that will fix that whole SS/Medicare problem, aye?

:sigh


I am strongly anti-abortion . . . but to play devil's advocate to your point - the response would be (from those who are bold enough) that eliminating the unborn and elderly would also reduce the total amount of people who would be claiming Social Security . . . it's a dark point, but one you might encounter.

[Dilferthecat]

Indeed.

Politicos want to clamor about the economy. Pity we murdered the working force that would have supported it.

:nod excellent point, Christine. How awful. :cry God have mercy on us, although we don't deserve it. :cry

[cameron222]

Yes, little dead babies will not be a burden to society and suck up social security, medicaid and nursing home services.....but those same little babies would have been employees somewhere and would have kicked in enough ss tax to pay your benefits so you could live a comfortable life in your old age.

Plus, in my opinion, we probably aborted the doctors and researchers that would have found a cure for heart disease and cancer and a whole hosts of scientists who would have made discoveries that would have sloved many of the problems in our world.

But we will never know that....will we?

[crtwhlfrchrst]

Yes, little dead babies will not be a burden to society and suck up social security, medicaid and nursing home services.....but those same little babies would have been employees somewhere and would have kicked in enough ss tax to pay your benefits so you could live a comfortable life in your old age.

Plus, in my opinion, we probably aborted the doctors and researchers that would have found a cure for heart disease and cancer and a whole hosts of scientists who would have made discoveries that would have sloved many of the problems in our world.

But we will never know that....will we?


Again, you know the response to that one . . . "We probably aborted some terrorists and some mass murderers . . ."

[Christine]

I am strongly anti-abortion . . . but to play devil's advocate to your point - the response would be (from those who are bold enough) that eliminating the unborn and elderly would also reduce the total amount of people who would be claiming Social Security . . . it's a dark point, but one you might encounter. Economics 101: The current workforce contributions into the system are the monies being used to pay out the current retired folk's benefits.

Add 10 years and do the math.

:):

Your suggestion that eliminating the elderly so as to have to not pay them from a system that they contributed their lives to would make Hitler proud.

[BHiles]

One important point is that the seed that is actually sown in most every case is fornication. Fornication hits closer to home for most believers. Many would be against Abortion but still practice fornication wantonly. Just because they use another form to hide their sin they feel justified in their sin. Abortion is a sin covering. Wicked as it is it is the same exact covering used by David against Uriah. The seed of this sin is fornication and this seed must be dealt with first and primarly. We are attacking the result of the seed sown as opposed to the seed itself. We will never win that battle because the wickedness thrives whether or not the sin coverup is ever dealt with under civil law. God will punish us for the seed of the sin more likely than the coverup regardless of how wicked it is. Read the accusations against David by Nathan. It dealt with the seed of the sin and not the coverup.

Jas 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Reference:
II Samuel 12:1 And the LORD sent Nathan unto David. And he came unto him, and said unto him, There were two men in one city; the one rich, and the other poor. 2 The rich man had exceeding many flocks and herds: 3 But the poor man had nothing, save one little ewe lamb, which he had bought and nourished up: and it grew up together with him, and with his children; it did eat of his own meat, and drank of his own cup, and lay in his bosom, and was unto him as a daughter. 4 And there came a traveller unto the rich man, and he spared to take of his own flock and of his own herd, to dress for the wayfaring man that was come unto him; but took the poor man’s lamb, and dressed it for the man that was come to him. 5 And David’s anger was greatly kindled against the man; and he said to Nathan, As the LORD liveth, the man that hath done this thing shall surely die: 6 And he shall restore the lamb fourfold, because he did this thing, and because he had no pity. 7 And Nathan said to David, Thou art the man. Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, I anointed thee king over Israel, and I delivered thee out of the hand of Saul;

[Redmow]

I don't get it. As a people, our morals become tied to legal documents...and therefore legal. We tend to over-rationalize everything, obscuring the simple truth. That this world is no game and God means business. No Constitution of any country (no matter how straight you walk its line) will save you.

The irony is we created governments and our own creation is bringing us down. They are all rebelling against God. Even Israel. Yes, even this country...Judiciary, Legislative and Executive. Even the leaders who claim to be Christian (in the Senate and House) grow weak-kneed when confronted with political back-lashes.

I don't remember a time in history that a nation so trashed itself. Why would a body inflict pain upon itself? I just don't get it.

Edit: President Bush in not faultless, either. Believe me, I would never cast a vote for someone who wishes to make America more liberal (at least knowingly) but I am sorely disappointed with the President and his handling of Israel.

Edit again: Ooops. Sorry. Got carried away.

[cameron222]

BHiles makes good points, as usual. I have never seen sexual sins so rampant. But again....as it was in the days of Lot.

I watch a lot of Leave It To Beaver and Andy Griffith and the sex is so subtle and low key that you almost miss it, plus it is always in the proper context. June and Ward never eye each other and head for the bedroom. Andy has a deceased wife and is not sleeping around in obedience to his hormones.

But today, the sit coms major on sexuality, low cut blouses, cleavage in abundance, sexual exploits outside of marriage and me me me me me me!!!!

Ward and June would be blushing and shaking their heads!!

And.....it will only get worse before Jesus returns.

[jerbear]

I for one just cannot deny that the Rapture of the Church is so close. All the signs are sooo there. Every time I think the world in general can't get any worse, and I am totally shocked, along comes a news story that shocks me. It makes you wonder what it will be like DURING the tribulation.

[GAB]

One of the more disturbing habits of those who fanatically support anything is the assumption that anyone who doesn't actively support them 100 percent is the enemy. This is why revolutions consume their leaders after the revolution; the fanatics control the State. It also happens in the pro-Life movement. Randall Terry had the position that anyone who didn't actively oppose abortion committed a sin. Well, what if you weren't in a position to give it 100 percent of your time? I don't like abortion but God has called me into serving my nation directly.

[Chris4Christ]

The moral aspect of abortion is surely wrong, but man will now reap the whirlwind in economic and social ills from such a demonic decision.
No, he won't. Because he'll just come up with more demonic acts to perpetrate which will negate any repercussions for previous evils...such as what we have now supported the legalization of, killing the disabled.

The only time men will reap what they sow is when they stand in judgment before the Lord. THEN they will no longer be able to deny the evil in their hearts.

[cameron222]

Chris, you don't think the sins of man have current repercussions? :confused

I agree that judgement day will bring a reward or punishment for ones activities, but I see a lot of damage in the here and now that is a result of evil behavior.

[frisian1970]

America crossed a thresh hold this week. Euthinasia.
The arguments pro and con about the Terri case do not change the fact that a judge ordered the death of a woman WITHOUT A LIVING WILL.
There was another story here on RR about a disabled baby aborted against his parents wishes.

When abortion was first being debated, a prediction was made. Abortion would ultimately lead to euthinasia. and it happened this week. When the Supream Court refused to review the case, a prescedent was allowed to stand: the judicially ordered death of a disabled patient. there was NO living will.

Kevorkian broke the ice, and is in jail now.
Terri is the legal standard.
Its not a far step towards euthinasia for the elderly and disabled.

We sowed the seeds of abortion. And now the fruit is ripening.
Welcome to the future.
Come soon, Lord. Please.Since Bush was elected and will likely nominate more judges, including the Supreme Court...that will change though...right?

[frisian1970]

No, he won't. Because he'll just come up with more demonic acts to perpetrate which will negate any repercussions for previous evils...such as what we have now supported the legalization of, killing the disabled.
Any scripture to back up the assertion?

[frisian1970]

One of the more disturbing habits of those who fanatically support anything is the assumption that anyone who doesn't actively support them 100 percent is the enemy. This is why revolutions consume their leaders after the revolution; the fanatics control the State. It also happens in the pro-Life movement. Randall Terry had the position that anyone who didn't actively oppose abortion committed a sin. Well, what if you weren't in a position to give it 100 percent of your time? I don't like abortion but God has called me into serving my nation directly.
Randall Terry? The one who disowned his daughter because she got pregnant outside of marriage?

[Christine]

Any scripture to back up the assertion?
Matthew 10:21 & 24:12, Isaiah 5:20.

Need more?

[B A N E]

No, he won't.

That's not accurate. There are current and ongoing repercussions for
sin.

Because he'll just come up with more demonic acts to perpetrate which will negate any repercussions for previous evils...such as what we have now supported the legalization of, killing the disabled.

This is correct...as per Christine's references.


The only time men will reap what they sow is when they stand in judgment before the Lord. THEN they will no longer be able to deny the evil in their hearts.

While it is true that at the judgements, man will reap his final harvest.
Scripture shows clearly that there are current punishments for sin.


James 1:15
15 Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death .
NIV


Examples are all over the Bible.

Adam & Eve paid both immediately, during their life and after for their sins.

Abraham & Sarah paid during their lifetime for the error of bringing Hagar
into their bed.

Lot paid for his lack of faith in the message brought by the angels.

Esau paid for his sins...loss of favor, blessing etc.

David paid

etc.

[Chris4Christ]

:doh

I meant repercussions in the economic and social sense, as Cameron posted.

I'm well aware that sin begets more sin...and that was pretty much my point. And I'm also well aware that the penalty for sin is death. If I weren't, I wouldn't be a Christian now, would I?

And, no, I don't believe there will be any repercussions HERE that will matter to man, that he won't try to avoid with even more sin.

[frisian1970]

Matthew 10:21 & 24:12, Isaiah 5:20.

Need more?I believe such occurs, that isn't my question. Whether we can know of certain instances that enlighten us to absolute discernment in relation to an individual rather than vague attributions was my question.

[Christine]

Reread her post -- she was referring to 'man' as 'mankind' not as in John Q. Public III of Whocares, Nameastate.

[frisian1970]

Reread her post -- she was referring to 'man' as 'mankind' not as in John Q. Public III of Whocares, Nameastate.Hmm, indeed you are correct. :doh

[B A N E]

Reread her post -- she was referring to 'man' as 'mankind' not as in John Q. Public III of Whocares, Nameastate.

I still disagree.
Scripture shows that mankind reaps current and ongoing repercussions
for sin. One of the things about the giving of the Law at Sinai to Israel
was that had Israel obeyed the Law (nevermind the impossibility), Israel
would have shown like a beacon, perpetually blessed by God (as it will be
during the MK.) Israel would have stood in stark contrast to the fallen
world.

I also agree with C4C that we'll devise some other short sighted solution
that is arguably uglier than the root of the problem in the first place...
with regards to the OP.

[Chris4Christ]

I also agree with C4C that we'll devise some other short sighted solution that is arguably uglier than the root of the problem in the first place...with regards to the OP.
And that's pretty much my point. I understand that there are repercussions, although man will continue to get worse and worse and commit more and more evil in an effort to avoid as much repercussion as possible...but with regard to reaping what we sow, which is what I was originally speaking about (and I believe there's a distinction), that's really not going to happen until the Judgment...certainly not FULLY.

Also, Mankind (at least unbelievers) don't even understand the depths of their depravity, I don't believe, because they are so lost in the darkness. They call evil good, and they believe it because they are so far removed from God. Therefore, they don't see and understand any current repercussions for what it is. It isn't until the Judgment that they'll know and understand, and that's when they'll truly be reaping what they sowed.

[Elizabeth_S]

Originally Posted by Chris4Christ
No, he won't. Because he'll just come up with more demonic acts to perpetrate which will negate any repercussions for previous evils...such as what we have now supported the legalization of, killing the disabled.

Any scripture to back up the assertion?
Matthew 24:12
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
:nod