Baptist question

[bopeep1909]

I know many of you go to Baptist churches. I was thinking of attending a Baptist church but there are many kinds. Southern,independent etc. What is the difference? Are there some that are too legalistic? Are there some that are more conservative? Some that are too liberal? I know that there is a difference in the Lutheran churchs but what about the Baptist?<><

[nooneuno]

Hi! I'll try to help a little bit from what I know. I may be wrong on some of this:
Southern Baptist==fundamental..they vary on legalism. There are some (Bob Jones Univ style) that have "rules" being a member etc..
I go to a Southern Baptist now that is incredible..www.calvarynow.com
The southern's are particular about being "immersed" to become a member (not your salvation though)

Conservative Baptist Conf.--usually good churches also..not as conservative as the name declares about being legalistic. (in the northwest more)

General Baptist Conf. Good churches..swedish in origin ..SOME of these churches IMO have gotten too liberal..NOT all..but some.. (ex: Bethel College in MN)

American Baptist..liberal..pro abortion, etc..from what I know..forgiv me if I am wrong here...women pastors etc..

There is also Independent Baptist..now there are 2 kinds..one that is just plan independent from other Bapt. churches..and then there is the one tha is a denomination..legalistic IMO..uses King James ONLY..rules..etc..

If I were looking for a Bapt church..I'd consider southern..but screen if first for being overly legalistic (which I just don't do) and then GBC church

This is my best synopsis on this and I could be wrong about some of it. I grew up in an independent Bapt church on L.I., went to a Southern in Idaho that was legalistic..then went to a Conservative Baptist conf. (VERY GOOD), now am back to Southern here. This one is the best church I've ever been to!

[AnyDayNow]

First church I was in after became a Christian was BGC (Baptist General Conference) church. My wife and I had been attending an Evangelical Free church the past 5 years, but are now visiting a GARBC (General Association of Regular Baptist) church (one which the BGC church "morphed" into over the years). This "brand" has the Pre-mil, Pre-trib view as part of their accepted chruch DOCTRINE. Never regularly attended any other Baptist churches, but we have visited. Independent ones seem to flow with the pastor/leadership position on most controversial issues. KJV only or legalistic ones would be out of question for wife and I. Liberal ones the same.
Hope it helps.

[Singlesis]

They all differ greatly, depending on the pastor and congregation. My grandfather was an Independent Baptist preacher, but my parents raised us in a Southern Baptist church. They weren't as "strict" as Papah's church... but I've later learned that just meant they weren't as conservative. Sadly, many SBC churches today are falling into Purpose Driven stuff... which I'd advise staying away from. But there is a fine line between being conversative & holy, and downright legalistic. It seems the lesser "legalistic" churches are becoming too politically correct and won't preach against ANY sin, so as not to offend. So I'm now leaning back more toward the ultra-conservative Independant Baptist's. So they only use KJV. They still call a sin a sin, and aren't afraid to speak out against it. So... just depends on your comfort zone I suppose. But different ones under the same "label" can still be very different on the inside.

[sewserious]

Bascially, any church is like stated above. IT is not the name over the door but what is taught inside those doors that is important. Labels can only tell you so much.

[Gray Fox]

We have attended a BGC (Baptist General Conference) church for many years, but have seen it go down hill over the past few years. The following will give you some idea of what I mean:

*Began a expansion program three years ago that they really didn't need, in persuit of their seeker sensitive mentality.
*Removed the word "Baptist" from all view including the name of the church. Now our name is just as generic as any other church down the street. In my opinion, that's a form of deceit.
*A year ago they invited a muslim in to speak to the group to promote understanding and unity. They allowed a strange/evil spirit to infiltrate the house of God. And this was on a Sunday morning! I just could not attend that.
*Early this year they went through the Purpose Driven "40 Days of Purpose" campaign with small group meetings and the Message version. I couldn't do that either.
*A few months ago, they started to get the next phase of the expansion program under way with commitments from all.
*A few weeks ago they announced that we were becoming a church of small groups, not a church with small group studies. Big difference here!
*Now they are starting a 7 week series based on a book by Hybels who has close ties with Warren and Schuller, all of mega church fame. Small groups are heavily stressed along with sale of books, tapes, videos, etc.
*They now have two services of contempory worship and one of traditional worship.
*Can't remember the last time they preached on sin, repentence, the old rugged cross, end time prophecy or mentioned Israel. Just fuzzy, feel good stuff. Most people love it. Haven't heard an alter call in years.
*The contempory service has a loud band with with always new praise songs, videos, skits, etc along with the message.
*They are amil, no 7 year trib and no rapture.
*The BGC website appears to have removed any reference to their beliefs concerning the "hot" issues of today. Today, I just don't know anymore what they believe. Maybe they removed this stuff so no one would be offended and leave, however what they don't preach on speaks volumes.

If they condone anything that the bible says is an abomination to God, then it's time to leave now. Needless to say, we're looking but it's hard. I think all BGC churches have gone this route.

[Servant]

I attend an American Baptist Church after having grown up Southern Baptist.

:):


My experience with this branch of the denomination is limited, as my current church is the only one that I have attended. I do know, that we withdrew all but token support for our association due to it's liberalization. Our church also went through the forty days to purpose stuff a couple of years ago. I did not personally participate, but nothing nefarious has happened as a result. We do have more members attending small group study, but the small group that I attend chooses books/studies according to what interests us. Our last book was waaay to pablum for my taste, so I respectfully offered my opinion and this time we are doing a much deeper, more word-based study. :thumb


Anyway, I guess that I am trying to say that I don't think you can judge most churches according to the name over the door. But rather by the attitudes and actions and doctrines of it's membership.

[cindyw]

I would also let you know that there are many Freemasons in leadership in the Baptist Church---all branches. The Southern Baptist Convention did a "study" on the beliefs/practices of freemasonry and compatibility with Christianity in 1993 and came to the conclusion that Freemasonry had many elements which were in opposition to Biblical Christianity........http://www.namb.net/root/evangelism/iev/mason.asp

However, they did not take a definitive stance one way or the other in regards to Baptists who hold membership in lodges :freaked If you do decide to attend a Baptist Church, or any other church for that matter, you may want to consider asking if anyone in leadership is involved with Freemasonry/Shriners........

[Samer]

yes, there is much freemasonry in the Southern Baptist Convention, and i wouldn't be surprised if it were in other denominations as well.

I am very happy with the independent fundamental Baptist churches I've been to. Since it's not a denomination, just a name shared by unaffiliated likeminded churches, there can be some variation. They are generally very conservative. The ones I have been to support everything from the Bible, which is awesome. I think the dangers of what the world calls "legalism" is when it goes beyond the Bible. We believe in salvation by grace through faith--period. That being said, we earnestly strive to follow Jesus' commandments, and are thus stricter than other churches.

[nooneuno]

Gray Fox??
I have tryed to PM you or email you but you do not have either so I am writing here. Would you mind PM'ing me anything you know about Bethel College in St Paul, MN if you have some info? This is in regards to how they are spirituallly..maybe some backup facts also? (i think my niece is looking at the school as my dad went there wayyyyy back in the 1940's) My daughter looked at the school in 1998 and was leary in re: to their stance on Christianity, specifically Jesus.... thanks!

[rancherswife]

My husband has been a Southern Baptist all of his life. In his church, you don't have to be "dunked" to join (if you've been previously baptised). I was sprinkled and they will let me join the church because I was baptised. Alot of people have already stated that each church/pastor can run things a little differently. My suggestion is to read the doctrine of the Southern Baptist Church first (www.sbc.net (http://)) , and then find a church where you feel comfortable worshipping. I used to belong to a different denomination for many years. Because my pastor didn't totally follow the doctrines of the larger denomination, and only preached from the bible, I had no idea of the REAL doctrine of my denomination until I moved. When I attended another church I quickly discovered that I totally disagreed with most of the core beliefs of my former church. I don't have this problem with the Southern Baptist church, as it is very biblically based.

[Cash]

Hey there bopeep!

I've gone to a SBC church all my life...... but, being a Gideon speaker, I've gone to many different denominations over the past 7-8 yrs.

That being said, the SBC remains my favorite. From church to church, they remain the most Biblically sound, IMO. No way do I mean to say we have the market cornered concerning Biblical truths though.

Just check around, most certainly make it a matter of prayer :nod !

If there is a Mennonite church in your area, you might want to drop in. Freewill Baptist churches have been the friendliest, as a rule. Don't care for their saved on condition position, but I never felt uncomfortable at all.

PM me if you want to know more, or a particular denomination to avoid, IMO.

Take care........

[el Gusano]

yes, there is much freemasonry in the Southern Baptist Convention, and i wouldn't be surprised if it were in other denominations as well.

I am very happy with the independent fundamental Baptist churches I've been to. Since it's not a denomination, just a name shared by unaffiliated likeminded churches, there can be some variation. They are generally very conservative. The ones I have been to support everything from the Bible, which is awesome. I think the dangers of what the world calls "legalism" is when it goes beyond the Bible. We believe in salvation by grace through faith--period. That being said, we earnestly strive to follow Jesus' commandments, and are thus stricter than other churches.

What Samer said.

I would add, though, that many churches that go by the title "Independent Baptist Church", are quite often KJV Onlyists almost to the point of being cultish.

[onsolidrock]

I attended a SBC church for a couple of years. The sermons were always on "how to be saved" Anything beyond that was not considered a sermon. To me that was the milk of the Word and not the Meat. There was a definite lack of spiritual maturity in that church. It showed up in several church fights and splits over the years.

I was brought up in an American Baptist church. I left because of the heavy involvement in the Masonic Temple. The denomination has steadily become more liberal over the years. They are now to the point of accepting homosexuals into leadership. They have had women as Pastors since at least the 1960's.

I now belong to an Indepentant Baptist Church that is asocciated with the Bible Baptist Fellowship. They are KJV only. although not cultish about it. The KJV is one of the more accurate versions, so I don't have a problem with using it. There are a few churches in the BBF that are legalist and some that have become "too liberal". In Indepentant Baptist churches you have to look at the beliefs and doctrine of each church, because there can be difference among the churches in each denomination or fellowship as they perfer to call it.

[Gray Fox]

Gray Fox??
I have tryed to PM you or email you but you do not have either so I am writing here. Would you mind PM'ing me anything you know about Bethel College in St Paul, MN if you have some info? This is in regards to how they are spirituallly..maybe some backup facts also? (i think my niece is looking at the school as my dad went there wayyyyy back in the 1940's) My daughter looked at the school in 1998 and was leary in re: to their stance on Christianity, specifically Jesus.... thanks!

The only thing I know about them is what I have heard or read. For example, it's my understanding they have become quite liberal. They have changed their name from Bethel College and Seminary to simply Bethel University. I read in the newspaper that they now have co-ed dorms. Our previous pastor said he learned from Bethel professors that there will be no rapture or tribulation. I also believe they are affiliated with the BGC. That's all I know about them.

From my previous post, I mentioned that our church is BGC and very supportive of Bethel. In that post I also talked about some of the things our church is doing. I don't like it.

[LeahIA]

I grew up General Association of Regular Baptic Churches (GARBC) check out www.garbc.org & read their doctrinal statement, etc.. Its somewhat legalistic, but very fundamental & conservative in their beliefs.

[BHiles]

You got to love the way the word "legalism" is thrown around on this forum. The definition of legalism is a method of laws designed to obtain salvation or favour with God.

Most Independant Baptist Churches that get quickly labelled as legalistic is simply not true. Many teach a set of standards that in no way allow one to find favour with God but to allow one to be a useful vessel, crucified in the flesh to be used for the advancement of the kingdom.

If someone told you that watching Primetime TV or Movies was bad many would bristle and call that legalism however the Bible says: Ps 101:3 I will set no wicked thing before mine eyes: I hate the work of them that turn aside; it shall not cleave to me. This is not legalism this is wise biblical counsel. If you would take an honest look at the work being done today by independant fundamental Baptist churches, evangelical outreach and the stand for doctrinal truth you would be hard pressed to find a more determined people for the advancement of the kingdom.

[el Gusano]

Umm... when I use "legalistic", I'm referring to the artificial laws of man that have nothing to do with the Bible or with the Kingdom of God. I assume that most people use it that way. "You must do this or else!"

[HeIsEnough]

You got to love the way the word "legalism" is thrown around on this forum. The definition of legalism is a method of laws designed to obtain salvation or favour with God.

If someone told you that watching Primetime TV or Movies was bad many would bristle and call that legalism however the Bible says: Ps 101:3 I will set no wicked thing before mine eyes: I hate the work of them that turn aside; it shall not cleave to me. This is not legalism this is wise biblical counsel. If you would take an honest look at the work being done today by independant fundamental Baptist churches, evangelical outreach and the stand for doctrinal truth you would be hard pressed to find a more determined people for the advancement of the kingdom.

I certainly do not think Baptists have a lock on legalism, its pretty much everywhere. Too many want a set of laws which to live by, rather than being led by the Spirit. If your led by the Spirit, He will remove the desire. If your led by the law, the desire will remain, even though you do not break the law which you have set in your heart. Legalism is better seen in the results of the heart, rather then the call for holy living.

[Brad MetalMan]

I certainly do not think Baptists have a lock on legalism, its pretty much everywhere. Too many want a set of laws which to live by, rather than being led by the Spirit. If your led by the Spirit, He will remove the desire. If your led by the law, the desire will remain, even though you do not break the law which you have set in your heart. Legalism is better seen in the results of the heart, rather then the call for holy living.

No, the Baptists don't have a lock on legalism at all. There is alot of it in the Pentecostal churches. We find ourselves in a situation much like the Baptists, you have those that are less legalistic, then you have those that preach against sin and take a stand for righteousness, but are not legalistic, and then you have some watered down, seeker sensative at the cost of the truth type churches.

[Morningstarlet]

I have only attended Baptist Churches, so here my take on it. When I first became saved I went to an Independent Baptist Church that was very legalistic: KJV only, women can only wear dresses (no slacks), etc. I'm now attending an Independent Baptist Church that is not legalistic. I've been to Southern Baptist Churches that were as dead as a stone and others that were okay. So I guess the answer is to check each church individually and not put a label on any particular Baptist church.

[rtd2]

ALL this legal talk makes me glad I attend a christian church not affiliated with ANY organization Except HEAVEN! we teach out of the KJ bible and babtize...the HOLY SPIRIT is evident in ALL our services...... some women wear dress and some pants! its up to their on conviction... salvation is between you and GOD! not what MAN-MADE religion says! ;): Now I dont beleive in Charismatic stuff(anything goes) BUT WHO among us can define HOLY my theroy is if your convicted about it stop it but dont judge your neighbor YOUR opinion of holy! I dont have ANYTHING against organized churches some people need more structure than others...I personally just cant sit through something thats scripted. Its seems to QUENCH the spirit! if its there at all!....just my 2 cents worth...

[antsinmypants]

I've tried to comment on this one a few times actually.. computer/internet keeps bombing out on me.

Anyway. I've been to independent and SBC churches that were solid, and ones that were "country club plasticy" and very lukewarm.

I mean, how much more lukewarm do you get when people are talking in Wednesday night class and sunday school about going to a party and getting drunk and "having a good time" with all their friends and boyfriends/girlfriends.. and people talking about issues that are very liberal in leaning "woman's right to an abortion" on down the line to "being gay is OK".

I've also been to congregations where we were asked, due to SOME of the female people who were attending-- not to wear pants, because others had abused the right and come in things that left nothing to the imagination, and our pastor had to step on that line and say "Nothing other than skirts and dresses unless you're visiting and don't know, and G-d will sort you out. We've had too many problems with people dressing inappropriately and causing problems for the men."

I agree with him now, but didn't then. I was 12-14. I wore nothing BUT jeans, because I was between sizes and growing fast. All my dresses were hand-me-downs and all were 1980s styles in the 1990s. (yes, very shallow, i know)

I've been to congregations that were solid that were IBC and ones that were SBC, and ones that used all types of bibles, and ones that used only the KJV.

Legalism is when we step outside of the bible and make up our own rules "clothes must reach this length", "Fish only on fridays".. etc.

The bible does say to dress modestly... and if people are abusing the good graces of the pastor and congregation, I can see why a dress code would become nessisary.


anyway.. Do not judge a congregation just because of it's name.. Check out each one's docrinal stance, and where they stand on Masonry.

[LeahIA]

Umm... when I use "legalistic", I'm referring to the artificial laws of man that have nothing to do with the Bible or with the Kingdom of God. I assume that most people use it that way. "You must do this or else!"This is what I was referring to also. When I attended my previous church, I had to wear my "Scarlet D" and was looked down on. I now attend a Christian & Missionary Alliance.