Ongoing argument with hubby!

[Sweets]

Recently,I became "born-again" and my hubby(he is Catholic) and I have been having this argument ever since.I'll try to describe it as best I can and hopefully you all can give me some input.


My hubby says that you don't have to ask God with your own mouth to become your Savior and ask that your sins be washed away.He seems to think that because he was raised Catholic that he repented to priests so he knows he will go to Heaven when Jesus comes.I don't know how all that works but, I thought you had to speak to God from your heart and ask him to forgive you of all sin. Presently,he does not "practice" whatsoever.Does he need a wake up call???? Help me out here....I would like to know how that works.


Hope this is on the right board...admins...do as you must if it isn't...:B:

[Rom831]

There are no magic words to speak. Jesus says all who believe in Him. You must love the Lord your God with all your mind, body and soul. It doesn't have to be a verbal thing with god, but it has to be "spoken" by your heart. So he doesn't have to verbalize it to God, just like verbalizing it to a priest has no power. God judges the heart.

Bless...ArtS

[Sweets]

Thanks again Rom.:D:

[Nimrod]

Well, I'll give another opinion

My fav verse is this:
Rom 10:9 Because if you confess the Lord Jesus, and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you shall be saved.

Checkout the definition of "confess", it usually means to actualy "speak" something with your mouth.

Another point---If you look at different translations of Romans 10:9---The NIV for instance---It reads....."If you confess WITH YOUR MOUTH...." Kind of drives home the point, 'eh?
Further proof of need of the mouth...check out the very next verse, Romans 10:10, clearly requiring use of the mouth.....
Rom 10:10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth one confesses unto salvation.
Now, isn't that interesting! The heart can bring righteousness, the mouth is needed for salvation....
Just my two cents worth Sweets!


Sweets, I know personally of the difficulty you are in! I too have married a Catholic. We married 15 years ago, neither of us living our faith. As we had children, my wife began do rediscover her Catholic roots and is now very involved in Catholic religious education. She has become a truely a committed Catholic, and I believe she is committed to God (is she "bornagain? I still don't know). Only over the last 3 years have I realized my relationship with Christ, who I am in Him, and what God has done for me (I had a "born-again" experience over 25 years ago). My wife and I have had MANY discussions and unfortunatly, fights over your very concern with your spouse. The problem----if your Catholic spouse only needs to believe in their heart, or partake in the rituals of the church....how do you know the true status of their salvation? I'm still searching for that answer. I can only rest in the fact that:
--my spouse needs to see a change in my life if my wittness is to carry weight
--my message needs to be carefully guarded with love and respect for her position
--ultimatly God is in control, He is the only one who DOES know the condition of a Catholic spouses (my wife/your husbands) heart, and our heart too for that matter.

One thing we have tried that has broken down some barriers is to do a little Bible study. Example, we took the contentious issue of infant baptism (we also tried the "Rosary"). We each took two weeks and reviewed Scriptural support for how our denomination practises baptism. We then met one night, prayed for guidance and reviewed what each side had found in a loving and intelligent manner. Was very enlightening, for both sides. And it served to began to open up an avenue of communication over contentious issues.
No matter what you do, find a way to speak to your spouse about his religeous beliefs in more detail. You can certaily pray daily for him. From what you've stated, he may or may not be saved, it sure would be nice to know though!

I believe MANY Catholics are born again, even though they practise cultural and rituals I find offensive. It's not our "label" that saves us, it's who we know in our hearts.

Peace

[Jany]

The Bible teaches that we are to “confess our sins one to another” (James 5:16); it never mentions confession to a priest. The reason why Protestants “confess their sins one to another” and not to a priest, has nothing to do with the issues of forgiveness of sins but rather individual reconciliation among true believers in Christ. In fact, there is no reason to confess our sins to a priest if Christ’s death on the cross has already paid
their full divine penalty.

Protestants believe that all believers have been given the right of access to God through Christ and are able to go directly to God in prayer. 1 Timothy2:5 declares, “For there is one God and one Mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus.” If Christ is the true Mediator between God and man, then men should confess their sins to Him, not to a priest. http://www.maverickreport.com/images/smilies/goldfish.gif <><

[BHiles]

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

[sandy111]

got a problem here,
lets say "terri" the lady whos been in the news lately,
accepted Christ into her heart after all this happened to her...
she can't talk! does that mean she will not receive salvation?
something is wrong with this picture....
what about the poor person who paralized and can't move their mouth??
what is coming across is they cant be saved because they
can't "confess" it with their mouth.

[evangelyn]

I didn't confess with my mouth at the time I was born-again. In fact, having spent my entire life thinking I was a "Christian" it never occurred to me that I wasn't saved or that I even needed to SAY the sinner's prayer. However, looking back at the day everything changed, I realize that my silent prayer had all the components of the sinner's prayer and it was truly sincere and from the heart.

I wasn't a "textbook convert" (Biblical, yes...textbook, no.:pound )and maybe your husband isn't or won't be either.

Does he need a wake-up call? Probably. But tread carefully. He has to want it, and the differences between Protestants and Catholics will make it difficult for you two to even speak the same language. Just keep praying that his heart will be softened.

[Nimrod]

Sandy---your problem isn't with us as we have offered no opinion. Your problem is with Scripture. Read it yourself--got another spin on it?---lay it on us. I certainly make no claim to knowledge of God's intent. I certainly don't understand why God chose to specificaly state the use of ones mouth, none the less---he did say it.

Peace

[sandy111]

don't have a problem with you or scripture,
just the interpretation of it.


whats not being addressed is that some folks cant even move their mouths....
Gods not going to leave them behind because they can't speak.
Its whats in the heart! when its in the heart, they may want to speak, but can't. Gods not going to leave them behind.
We need to read that whole chapter and understand.
We need to be clear when we say things, so some that are struggling will not misunderstand and think well I can't move my mouth so I can't confess so I'm lost.

[Louie]

generally if we are a Christian- folks will know it- kind of like if we're married folks should know it- our lives and actions and words are "confessing" it. it isn't a ritual- with magic words - it's just that with our lives it's an obvious thing. Obviously for those who can speak Jesus is something we should naturally be talking about- for others their "speech" is different- as in sign language for the deaf, or our countenance and actions for the handicapped. It doesn't have to mean with the mouth necessarily- just that that is the normal way MOST folks might first notice we're saved. Kind of like we're not ashamed of the Gospel thing- we are confessing Jesus with our words, actions and life. JMHO

[Nimrod]

Sandy--
please share your interpretation of the above cited verses?

Peace

[cameron222]

A person can believe without speaking. We have to believe thet God raised Jesus from the dead.

And yes we are told to confess with our mouth....but I do not believe for one second that God would not extend salvation to a deaf mute.

[Nimrod]

How true Cameron!

But then, we are talking about a spouse able to speak. Why did God lead Paul to write it? ( I cited the verses only as they blantently referance the use of the mouth---in response to Sweets question).

My own personal opinion---We are not saved by the physical act of using our mouth. I think Paul is saying we must live a life thats outwardly visable to others who we serve. Does our salvation hinge on it---I think not, as we are saved not by any work we may do. Nothing but the blood of Jesus....

Peace

[sandy111]

thats what I was trying to say! Read Louies post and the others, its in the fruit of the life, although for some they may not be able to use the mouth!

[Vickimac]

Another thought to ponder: The mouth can lie, but the heart cannot. Maybe that is why God looks to the heart.:D:

I believe that we should confess WITH our mouth, not just our heart, if we can. But salvation is a heart matter. The mouth follows.

[Rom831]

I think Vickimac has it. Yes it says we should confess our faith with our mouths. It says a LOT of things we SHOULD do if we are saved. But these are things we should do if we are saved, not conditions to be saved.

The thief on the cross did not say the sinners prayer. He simply said Jesus was innocent and asked Jesus to remember him when He got to His kingdom.

In fact, we are told that there will be those who do confess it but don't mean it. To them, Jesus will say "I never knew you." So confessing has no power in itself. Why? God's word also tells us that it is not the mouth that condems us but it is our heart. We are not condemned neither by what we say nor by what we don't say (even if we don't verbally say a sinner's prayer). We are condenmned by our hearts. If we have not accepted Christ into our hearts, we are condemned. Which means the reverse is true as well, if we HAVE accepted Him into our heart, we are not condemned.

Again, yes, we SHOULD declare our salvation to the world. Not once, but in everything we do. Just as we should follow all of Jesus commands and live a life that is honorable to Him and gives glory to Him. This includes confessing Him, teaching, spreading the Word, loving our neighbor, rebuking sin, doing good works and much more. But these are because of our salvation, not conditions for salvation.

Bless...ArtS

[evangelyn]

Great, just great :freaked...now I'm questioning my own conversion experience. I think I'll go read my Bible in search of some answers :cry

[sandy111]

it all starts with the heart.
my sil confess with her mouth all the time "jesus is Lord"
but theres no heart involved and NO fruit whatsoever that is the fruit of the HS. this is wof, and I think the post above saying the heart can't lie, but the mouth can, is true.

[Vickimac]

Originally posted by evangelyn
Great, just great :freaked...now I'm questioning my own conversion experience. I think I'll go read my Bible in search of some answers :cry

I think this is why we are told to work out our own salvation with trembling. We all need to check our hearts, that they are truly, completely His. God doesn't want just lip service, he wants our hearts. ;): (You're searching in the right place, evangelyn!):thumb

[ylf1999]

Originally posted by Sweets
Recently,I became "born-again" and my hubby(he is Catholic) and I have been having this argument ever since.I'll try to describe it as best I can and hopefully you all can give me some input.


My hubby says that you don't have to ask God with your own mouth to become your Savior and ask that your sins be washed away.He seems to think that because he was raised Catholic that he repented to priests so he knows he will go to Heaven when Jesus comes.I don't know how all that works but, I thought you had to speak to God from your heart and ask him to forgive you of all sin. Presently,he does not "practice" whatsoever.Does he need a wake up call???? Help me out here....I would like to know how that works.


Hope this is on the right board...admins...do as you must if it isn't...:B:

what about those that are mute?

I think asking Jesus into your life is heart thing and it really doesn't matter if you verbally asked him into your life

YBIC

[evangelyn]

Just a side note...

If anyone is interested, I started another thread in the Bible Study forum concerning the whole "confess with your mouth" topic.

Whew...feeling much better, now thanks!

[pilgrimian]

Originally posted by cameron222
A person can believe without speaking. We have to believe thet God raised Jesus from the dead.

And yes we are told to confess with our mouth....but I do not believe for one second that God would not extend salvation to a deaf mute.

Excellent point.

Many people are saved in the pews...long before they ever make it down the aisle to say they agree, or accept it!